Author Topic: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)  (Read 386 times)

madbean

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Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« on: January 13, 2019, 06:59:26 PM »
The set-up: I've been vegetarian for going on 4 years now. I did it purely out of ethical concerns (I certainly love the taste of meat although I don't miss it). Been really successful with it, never slipped up once. Caveat: I have been eating fish once a month over that period so obviously I am not a "true" vegetarian. I did that purely out of health concerns, IOW, an extra source of protein once in a while.

Over the last year or so I tried to do the low-carb thing. For a while I did very well on it but I find it incredibly hard to maintain. You have to really earn any weight loss you get through low carb. And, it took very little change in my eating habits to gain back nearly everything I lost (I dropped and gained back about 25lbs in 2018). So, I'm starting on a different path: high starch, whole food, plant based. Basically vegan except I refuse to give half n half with my coffee (out of my cold dead hands). The idea is adopting this kind of eating means you do not have to moderate carbs, but you stick to primarily high starch foods to help counteract them. It's a way to help get/stay full with a much lower calorie load to promote weight loss. And, of course, whole food/plant based eating is incredibly healthy.

Anyway, I'm starting this thread to document my progress over the next few weeks and also to open it up in case anyone else has tried this and has good feedback. Or, recipes, haha.

PS: I'm not a evangelist with the meat thing. I do personally feel people should think about the ethical side of it but I'm not the guy who is going to shame anyone over what they like to eat. I'm the last guy to pass judgement on anyone!
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cooder

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2019, 07:19:59 PM »
Good on ya.
We've been eating paleo style diet with moderate meat content for some 3 years or so now and feel good on it.
It means gluten free, dairy free and grain free.
What's left you might ask? Lots. Vegetables, some meat, fish, more vegetables, fruit, nuts, berries. And veggies. Coffee, tea, almond milk (not so much soy as that has impact on your hormones). Once you have your pantry adjusted it's easy to cook and make meals.
No calorie counting, eating to satiety. Lost 10 kg without trying and balanced in on what seems my normal weight.

There is a lovely dark chocolate here that is dairy free and super delicious, a life saver... (Whittaker's Dark Ghana).
Overall no hardship when you would sit at our dining table.

Good luck, looking forward to see how you're getting on and what your experience will be.


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madbean

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2019, 07:39:40 PM »
There is a lovely dark chocolate here that is dairy free and super delicious, a life saver... (Whittaker's Dark Ghana).
Overall no hardship when you would sit at our dining table.

Good luck, looking forward to see how you're getting on and what your experience will be.

Thanks! I pretty much gave up sweets over a year ago and I don't really miss them. I do have sweetener in my coffee (again, my weakness) and other than a very rare treat of a cookie or something I have zero cravings for processed sugar. The thing I found is once you give up a good bit of processed sugar, fruits get incredibly intense. Just a banana or a bit of pineapple is like "wow, this more sugar than I should be eating", haha. I saw a video the other day with Penn Gilette where he swore by mixing blueberries with cacoa powder and cyenne pepper. I might give that a try.
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cooder

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2019, 07:56:25 PM »
Yes we also feel that fruit etc tastes so much richer and sweeter when your down from that white sugar stuff that's mixed in so much. That's another thing: we buy very little to no processed food in super market because it typically contains gluten, sugar and stuff. So lots of  unprocessed food and we enjoy making things ourselves as well where we know exactly the ingredients. We make preserves, olives, kamboucha, pesto, hummus, sauerkraut, kimchi,... and it's fun and very tasty.
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somnif

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2019, 08:09:04 PM »
I hit 250lbs last May, and decided that disgusted me, so I would lose weight.

At first, I tried Keto. Honestly, wasn't that "hard" and it worked wonders (5lbs in the first week) but god DAMN did it WRECK my mental acuity. Couldn't keep a thought in my brain for more than a few seconds, couldn't sleep, my brain was just garbage. Also gave me acetone breath, which was annoying. I gave up on it after about 4 weeks (Plus, its expensive and I live on a grad student income).

So, after that I swapped to basic portion control (bought some 1-cup tupperwear-esque containers and use those as my plates/bowls for meals), few-to-no sweets, and adding more physical activity. I walk as much as I can, like parking on the wrong side of the mall from where I want to go just for the excuse. I have a cheap recumbant stationary bike I picked up and do a bit of that a day (~10 miles, less than an hour).

Annoyingly stress at work kept me from hitting my goal (wanted to be under 200 by new years), but I'm around 205 now and still trending down, if slowly. If nothing else its nice to fit in a smaller pants size.

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2019, 08:32:51 PM »
Just be careful that you are getting enough protein and a reasonably balanced diet.  Too many people jump into a vegan diet without planning enough (not saying that is what you would do).  While I'm not a vegetarian, I'm married to one.  As long as she's healthy, I support whatever diet she chooses.

I hope it works out well for you, Mr. Bean.

Personally, I need to get off the holiday eating (too many sweets, too much high calorie food).  I don't need to drop a ton of weight, but I had to stop running due to compressed discs in my lower back, so I need to dig back into cardio and get my heart rate back up on a regular basis.  The only thing that's kept me going is that I was able to continue to do some weight training despite my back (which doesn't sound like it makes sense, but it's helped offset my holiday eating somewhat).  Time for healthier eating and more cardio.
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HamSandwich

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2019, 08:43:06 PM »
Eating right is certainly half the equation to a healthy lifestyle. Excersize is usually just as critical and itís hard to have one without the other, should weight loss be your goal, unfortunately.

I realize Madbean switched up diets for ethical reasons, which is fantastic, but it seemed like the thread meandered into weight loss.

More power to you all. Iíve been trying to reduce my meat intake and treat more as a treat every once in a while with some nice organic pasture raised stuff or a good meal at a restaurant.

cooder

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2019, 09:09:15 PM »
Yes everyone to their own right and there's many reasons and ways to skin a cat or a vegan equivalent.

I recently got a wild pig from a friend who is a hunter, that made me feel really good because they are an introduced pest here and the freezer was full with gluten free yummy sausages... ;)
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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2019, 09:23:52 PM »
Iím gonna give a disclaimer and just say that I am a lunatic permaculture based gardener.  We eat as much of our own produce here as possible, and grow it to be as nutrient dense as possible too.  We are raising our own animals as garden helpers, and to eat, and are trying to get to a place where we only eat homegrown meat that is slaughtered and butchered here and produce grown here. 

Iíd encourage you to consider that most  grocery store produce is really pretty empty in terms of nutrients.  It doesnít matter if it is conventional or organic, the soils most store food are grown in are basically dead, and low nutrient.  They will be fertilized to feed them instead of getting nutrients from the soil.  If you can find a local CSA or Farmers market with growers that are working from a living soil/permaculture approach I think youíll find it a ton easier to live on the diet you are considering.  Also whatever you can grow yourself is always a great plan.  Now is the perfect time to start preparing beds for spring planting in healthy living soil.
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alanp

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2019, 10:26:27 PM »
I work at a slaughterhouse, so obviously have no problems with eating meat :) (every Christmas, everyone gets a free leg of lamb!)

I think I've mentioned this before, but growing up, my sister was medically diagnosed with coeliac disease. Whenever we went shopping, the back label on damn near everything had to be checked. When we went to McDonalds, back in the day, the only things she could have were the chips, and the coca-cola. If we went to Pizza Hut, Mum had to bring a home-made gluten-free base and explain to the kitchen staff not to contaminate it. This was back when gluten-free was a medical diagnosis and very "fringe", not a voluntary diet.

As a result, I've always taken the view that if you enjoy eating something, and are physically able to (ie, do not have coeliac disease, or a severe allergic reaction to seafood, etc), then go for it (in reasonable portions!)
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Willybomb

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2019, 03:16:53 AM »
I'm going to chime in on a few things, mainly because it sounds like you want to lose weight:

- You can't out train a bad diet.  It sounds like your diet is doing all the right things but the truth of the matter is that your body will adapt to make the most of what is coming in, meaning your metabolism is probably somewhat slower as a result. 

- That means you're going to have to up the exercise.  For my first tournament I dropped 7 kilos in two months or so and I wasn't training that often - Once a week, plus running 3-5k every second day, due to work commitments.  My diet, however, was steamed chicken breast and vegies for dinner, normal cereal breakfast, and I dropped the 3 chocolate bars a day to 1 freddo frog.  Several years and many fights later, due to stress and training twice a day in prep for a world tournament, I was down to 63kg and not nearly heavy enough.  I managed to get it back up to 65 for the tournament.  I didn't look healthy at 63.  And I was eating a 250g block of chocolate, a hamburger with the lot, and a 600ml coke for lunch every day just to keep the weight on.

- Don't worry about fad diets.  To quote Micheal Pollen, roughly:  Eat food, mostly plants.  Not too much.

- Long story short, add some exercise to your day or week, 3-4 times a day.  In my experience running gets it off fastest, but I hate running.

cajone5

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2019, 08:54:53 AM »
I’ll preface this post by noting that about 10 years ago now I read every science focused diet book I could find. The common denominators with  a couple of exceptions are to eat whole foods, avoid most grains,and avoid inflammatory foods (for most, dairy, beans, etc). It should go without saying that processed foods should also be avoided as well.

Anyway, through my own experimentation I landed on a mostly paleo diet. Through that I lost what little fat I had and, along with exercise (weight lifting), gained that weight back and then some as muscle. About 3 yrs ago I was diagnosed type 1 diabetic. And before this goes offf the rails, that’s the autoimmune one where your body attacks and kills the insulin producing cells in your pancreas, so my diet choices do not influence getting this. Anyway, since then I’ve reincorporated some carbs to help ease the process of medicating. This has come with a price; a bit more fat, a bit less energy, and a general heaviness when I eat outside my paleo diet. But it is what it is. Just noting as, without the diabetes, I’d be sticking to my prior diet.

So, this brings me to a brief but blunt commentary on ethics of diet... I’ll apologize in advance for sounding like an asshole.  I’d say your highest ethical obligation is to choose a diet that is healthy for yourself and your family. Personal choices here will not affect global change and martyring your health isn’t worth it. Unfortunately, your personal choices affect nothing other than your personal health. I know you’ll probably disagree, but I see no changes that result from such choices beyond the growth of the vegan processed foods section in my grocery store.

I’ll also add my personal interpretation for why vegetarian and vegan diets fail. These diets would only have been adopted, historically, in times of hardship. Hell, farming grew out of the hardship of supporting and feeding large groups of people. Anyway, as a result, one can sustain on such a diet, but will not thrive. And before anyone starts pointing to a healthy vegan or vegetarian they know, take your own survey of the unhealthy ones and measure your odds. I’d say it’s more likely they’re healthy despite their dietary choice, not because of it.

Final thought, reigning it back in, whatever diet you choose, ditching processed foods and being committed to just that step will make you far better off and far healthier than most. So, if you get only that far, you’re doing something right. 

« Last Edit: January 14, 2019, 08:57:52 AM by cajone5 »

madbean

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2019, 09:29:41 AM »
So, this brings me to a brief but blunt commentary on ethics of diet... Iíll apologize in advance for sounding like an asshole.  Iíd say your highest ethical obligation is to choose a diet that is healthy for yourself and your family. Personal choices here will not affect global change and martyring your health isnít worth it. Unfortunately, your personal choices affect nothing other than your personal health. I know youíll probably disagree, but I see no changes that result from such choices beyond the growth of the vegan processed foods section in my grocery store.

Iíll also add my personal interpretation for why vegetarian and vegan diets fail. These diets would only have been adopted, historically, in times of hardship. Hell, farming grew out of the hardship of supporting and feeding large groups of people. Anyway, as a result, one can sustain on such a diet, but will not thrive. And before anyone starts pointing to a healthy vegan or vegetarian they know, take your own survey of the unhealthy ones and measure your odds. Iíd say itís more likely theyíre healthy despite their dietary choice, not because of it.

Nah, there's absolutely nothing bad about anything you've stated. Of course, you are right that making a personal "ethical" decision does not change society as a whole. They never do. But, I disagree that it isn't a good enough reason. For me it's the best reason because I finally accepted that I have a choice and it was a very easy one to make. And, there are good reasons beyond just my personal feelings about eating animal meat. There is a large environmental factor to consider as well. Back to the point: if it compromised my health it would be a bad choice but it hasn't. My own health problems come from bad habits and a sedentary lifestyle. 

Anyway, I think you are right-on about processed foods. I avoid those as much as possible too. Everything is loaded with sugar.

Really, my intention here isn't to evangelize like I said. I only mentioned the vegetarian thing since it is relevant to my endeavor (which is all about me, haha). Trying a mostly vegan diet is more of an experiment right now with the intention of seeing if works for me to lose some weight and still feel healthy. Definitely not a cause celebre. I agree that fad diets are a waste of time, too. For me, it's always been about making permanent changes in my eating habits every couple of years to see how I do.

Also, you know that joke about economists? Ask four economists about the economy and you'll get six different opinions. I think the whole diet industry is even worse!
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Matmosphere

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2019, 10:30:12 AM »
Quote

Also, you know that joke about economists? Ask four economists about the economy and you'll get six different opinions. I think the whole diet industry is even worse!

Donít get why people think vegan is a bad word. Donít knock it until youíve tried it guys.

I have been vegetarian for 25 years and spend a year vegan a couple years back.

That year was easily the healthiest Iíve ever been. I lost 25 lbs without changing anything but my diet. I got sick way way less. I had more energy than Iíve had since I was a teenager. People told me I looked really healthy. Donít believe the lack of protein thing, sorry guys thatís crap, there is more than enough protein in a good vegan diet.

Itís a great thing to do for yourself, but it is a decent amount of extra work because there arenít a lot of options to eat out, and it takes a lot of planning. Eggs are hard to replace in baking, and Nutritional Yeast is kinda blah but a necessary evil from time to time.

We only gave it up because the stress of buying a house and moving and having kids got to be too much and we needed to just be able to order a couple pizzas.

I really need to get back to it but since it wouldnít be the whole family itís going to be hard.

BTW this is delicious (and vegan)

https://cookieandkate.com/2019/best-lentil-soup-recipe/

I have some more if you want them.





Also Oreoís are vegan (sorry if you didnít want to know that)

HamSandwich

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Re: Going for broke (healthy eating thread)
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2019, 03:28:48 PM »
Iím gonna give a disclaimer and just say that I am a lunatic permaculture based gardener.  We eat as much of our own produce here as possible, and grow it to be as nutrient dense as possible too.  We are raising our own animals as garden helpers, and to eat, and are trying to get to a place where we only eat homegrown meat that is slaughtered and butchered here and produce grown here. 

Iíd encourage you to consider that most  grocery store produce is really pretty empty in terms of nutrients.  It doesnít matter if it is conventional or organic, the soils most store food are grown in are basically dead, and low nutrient.  They will be fertilized to feed them instead of getting nutrients from the soil.  If you can find a local CSA or Farmers market with growers that are working from a living soil/permaculture approach I think youíll find it a ton easier to live on the diet you are considering.  Also whatever you can grow yourself is always a great plan.  Now is the perfect time to start preparing beds for spring planting in healthy living soil.

Are you claiming that typical store produce has less nutrients than reported, or that the reported numbers are correct, but could be more nutritious with healthier soil?