After many attempts, I have my first pcb etch. According to continuity tests, the traces are in tact...despite the imperfect etch. Hopefully I'll get to drill and populate soon. Experienced etchers, please let me know if you see any obvious issues.(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/13/damyza3u.jpg)
Drill it and build mang! That's super cool.
I'm stoked Jimi. The last etch I did didn't cut all the way through the copper and I had removed the toner before I realized it (working in low light).
I bought some harbor freight carbide bits and will hopefully drill tomorrow but it will be weeks before I can populate. Have to sell something and place an order
Looking good. The more you do the process the better they get.. I just love the whole process of etching, its very calming to me.
That's encouraging Selfdestroyer.
Hey Philo, I do a fair amount of etches, and I think you have done all right there. I think everyone that does an etch including myself has good and bad ones.
So just find what suits you and stick with it.
Etching is fun.
Mike
Was looking at old posts on my blog and I found my very first PCB etch.
(http://music.codydeschenes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/20121104-053316.jpg)
and here is one I made this week.
(http://music.codydeschenes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/20130903-145219.jpg)
If you want, take a look at my process here http://music.codydeschenes.com/?page_id=1388 (http://music.codydeschenes.com/?page_id=1388)
For the most part this is still my daily process for PCBs. I feel my game stepped up when I started using the HP Glossy Presentation Paper in the beginning of the year.
Awesome, thanks Selfdestroyer. I used Chromosphere's 'address label' for toner which worked the best for me so far. I wonder if my printer at work is not putting out enough toner. The printer at my local Kinkos was smearing the toner as it fed through the machine. May be time to buy my own:)
Looks great mate! I still have troubles with the transfer process but think that the adhesive backing and magazine paper worked the best for me!
Look, ive bought a solder mask on ebay which u can easily "paint" ur board by brushing it and it cures via sunlight after 10 minutes! If u nees more info let me know!
Cheers
My earlier ones were pretty bad, but they got better.
Here is a recent one
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb321/bitracer/Pedals/Little%20Angel/IMG_2223_zpsc3339540.jpg) (http://s1200.photobucket.com/user/bitracer/media/Pedals/Little%20Angel/IMG_2223_zpsc3339540.jpg.html)
For me PnP blue is what works.
That sounds interesting Gledison. What's it called?
That's fantastic Aballen!
Believe it or not gentlemen... I've never etched a PCB.
Congratulations, you are one level higher than me.
Jacob
Jacob, you're missing a trick there mate, before I got fed up of tearing my hair out with transfer after transfer not working properly, I used to love having to go over it all with a sharpie, then having to saw it and drill it, it's real fun!
Actually, saying that, I remember now, it was like hell!
In all fairness there is something really satisfying about knowing you've etched the board, much like doing your own layout and it firing up straight away.
George
I've lived in apartments with my small children since I had the opportunity to do something like etching. Because of that, I've always chosen to pay others to do the etching for me. I jumped onto Eagle and getting PCBs fabbed for myself early on though, because that was the most satisfying thing. Between having Ian or Austin or Brian etch PCBs for me, and then getting them manufactured... trust me, I got my fair share of satisfying moments.
But really, I know that I've never truly fully DIY'ed it yet. Kudos to the Etchers, you're one up on me.
Jacob
Jacob, you are not missing anything. Its satisfying when you get a good etch, but frankly its a real PITA. With services like OSHPark, and now their shared projects, it seems like etching really is not worth the trouble.
Quote from: PhiloB on September 13, 2013, 02:31:43 PM
That sounds interesting Gledison. What's it called?
Hey mate, here is the my previous post with the information:
http://www.madbeanpedals.com/forum/index.php?topic=10958.msg98545#msg98545
let me know if you need more information. it worked fantastic for me!!
Quote from: aballen on September 13, 2013, 05:28:59 PM
Jacob, you are not missing anything. Its satisfying when you get a good etch, but frankly its a real PITA. With services like OSHPark, and now their shared projects, it seems like etching really is not worth the trouble.
Unfortunately I do not agree with you. I can print out a design and in 45 minutes it will be etched, sanded and drilled and ready for me to populate. Its almost instant gratification. But, like i said in previous comments, I really enjoy it and it calms me to go through the whole process. Now saying this, I am learning Eagle (slowly) and cant wait to send something off to be fabbed but in the meantime etching is the way I prefer.
My etches are getting better but I find the through holes in a fabbed pcb seem to solder much better.
Jon P pointed out that better drill bits should help keep my holes from "puckering" I have to try that.
Quote from: aballen on September 13, 2013, 08:24:48 PM
My etches are getting better but I find the through holes in a fabbed pcb seem to solder much better.
Jon P pointed out that better drill bits should help keep my holes from "puckering" I have to try that.
Yes! That's the real difference. I can etch a board and have it today but it won't solder anywhere near as easily and cleanly as a fabbed board. Compared to home-etched, fabbed boards are a dream to work with. I'll definitely pay for that benefit on bigger and tighter layouts.
I certainly agree with you Jacob, the buzz from getting an eagle layout back, and it fires up, is a good one!
These days I much prefer tinkering on the computer, then a box of boards come In the post, all shiny and ready to go, I also like the solder mask, and it's less 'labour intensive' I'm not in to sanding and drilling!!
... but when you have to wait a month before the boards show up, you begin to think that it would be cool to etch them yourself and have themwithin an hour.
I'm starting etching tomorrow ;D
It's just one more aspect of diy. i enjoy a well etched board as much as a fabbed. I haven't etched myself because I just can't bear the thought of drilling it.
Quote from: selfdestroyer on September 13, 2013, 11:08:25 AM
If you want, take a look at my process here http://music.codydeschenes.com/?page_id=1388 (http://music.codydeschenes.com/?page_id=1388)
For the most part this is still my daily process for PCBs. I feel my game stepped up when I started using the HP Glossy Presentation Paper in the beginning of the year.
Really nice guide. My toner transfers have just about always been disasters. Like Jacob, I moved on to Laen and Seeed pretty quick. Like to get back to doing enclosures, though.
It's the instant gratification that attracts me to the etching. That said, I see the benefit of learning Eagle CAD.
I like the feeling I get from both. I've only had one OSH board come back and a second one coming, so that thrill is still new. But, I hate the drilling part. 15$ and a 2 week wait are well worth it to me not to have to drill things. Still, I do plan on continuing to etch for some things.
Quote from: PhiloB on September 14, 2013, 12:22:01 AM
It's the instant gratification that attracts me to the etching.
Bah, you're all missing out. The drug of choice for the truly impatient is perfboard! I can snap off a piece and !@#$ up a freehand layout in less time than it takes you to drill the holes, mwa ha haaa.
I've also never etched. I guess there's no middle ground for me ... it's either wait for a PCB to arrive or build it on pad per hole. Frankly the chemicals scare me. I fear most anything stronger than dihydrogen monoxide.
Quote from: midwayfair on September 14, 2013, 02:47:19 AM
...
Bah, you're all missing out. The drug of choice for the truly impatient is perfboard! I can snap off a piece and !@#$ up a freehand layout in less time than it takes you to drill the holes, mwa ha haaa.
...
I've only done one pedal on perf and it worked perfectly, but it hurt my brain to do it. It was the first pedal I did, so maybe I'd be a bit better at it now. But, it is a skill in its own right. You are right though, it's got to be the fastest way to get it done for a whole bunch of circuits.
Etching got me started and i have done quite a few however lately I have been getting the satisfaction of having my own pcbs fabbed. Come to think of it, once I got proficient with Eagle (And now Diptrace), I haven't etched a board.
A little advice for etching from my own experiences:
1). Make sure to use steel wool or scotch brite to clean the copper followed by acetone or other solvent.
2). Get some 0.8mm carbide drill bits from ebay. Forget using regular drills
3). Use MG chemicals "Liquid Tin". This stuff is great
Quote from: midwayfair on September 14, 2013, 02:47:19 AM
I fear most anything stronger than dihydrogen monoxide.
I see what you did there.
Jacob
^I enjoyed that one too!
Another attempt. P'n'P Blue this time.(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/17/uny3y4eq.jpg)
I like PNP blue, it's the only thing I've ever had success with!
That looks great. Good job!
I can do a respectable etch, but I think "print density" is one of the key things im missing. We have 2 HP laser jets at the office, neither have this option. Increasing print quality to 'pro-res' and removing all toner saving options makes an improvement but still doesnt pack on the toner in solid black areas and leaves those patchy areas. I'm going to have to look into that. My etchs would benefit from this change i think.
I learned that using acetone to remove the toner will leave your traces crisp. Originally I would sand them off.
One hint from my side:
I was having almost a hundred unsuccessfull transfers! The reason was that i was copying an pasting the layout in order to print several in the same page! I couldnt see tht the reaolution is afected, not visually! But when i printe and used the original pdf file, ive got 100% right! So no copy paste
The tables turned for my etches once I went to the HP Glossy Presentation paper and a printer I can set the print density to "5" and I iron the heck out of my etches.. I do it until I can see all the traces through the paper. Then I let it cool then I soak it in water and peel the paper off the copper. I use the green scrubby side of a kitchen sponge to clean off all the paper (I really thought this would remove the toner traces but it doesn't) then into the etch bath it goes. I am going to do some more etching tonight and will take some photos of the process again. I think its time to update my tutorial some anyways.
Cody
Quote from: selfdestroyer on September 17, 2013, 04:24:09 PM
The tables turned for my etches once I went to the HP Glossy Presentation paper and a printer I can set the print density to "5" and I iron the heck out of my etches..
Hi Cody, what printer do you use (with the print density feature)?
Quote from: catfud on September 17, 2013, 07:27:13 PM
Quote from: selfdestroyer on September 17, 2013, 04:24:09 PM
The tables turned for my etches once I went to the HP Glossy Presentation paper and a printer I can set the print density to "5" and I iron the heck out of my etches..
Hi Cody, what printer do you use (with the print density feature)?
http://music.codydeschenes.com/?page_id=1388 (http://music.codydeschenes.com/?page_id=1388)
From my blog post:
Laser Printer (HP LaserJet Pro P1102w with ePrint) I set the Print Density to 5 in the menu settings on the printer itself.
It has worked out well and it supports wireless ePrint and airprint. I love it since I can look at a build doc on my ipad and toss it to the printer and start etching.
Great first etch! My first etch attempt went straight to the garbage, and many others since then. It is definitely an art, and there are a lot of builders here who excel at it. I recently bought my first prefab board for a project, and I don't think I can go back to trying to etch myself...
Quote from: Gledison on September 17, 2013, 03:25:56 PM
One hint from my side:
I was having almost a hundred unsuccessfull transfers! The reason was that i was copying an pasting the layout in order to print several in the same page! I couldnt see tht the reaolution is afected, not visually! But when i printe and used the original pdf file, ive got 100% right! So no copy paste
I find that using Inkscape is fine for duplicating PDF layouts and also creating PDF files to print. No problem.
Acetone works great for cleaning board prior to etch as well as removing toner.
My favorite tool for etching is my modified GBC laminator. There is a how to on the net that shows you how to replace the thermistor inside and fuse to get a higher temp. Pretty easy and works great. Better results than an iron and was cheap to make.
Please point me to this article. My laminator has been more or less useless. I switches the gears to slow the rollers, but it just does not get hot enough.
Quote from: aballen on November 01, 2013, 01:07:03 AM
Please point me to this article. My laminator has been more or less useless. I switches the gears to slow the rollers, but it just does not get hot enough.
Glad to. I figured I would just gather a collection of links and make a more permanent thread about performing the mod on common laminators. The new thread is here, hope it helps shed some light on this:
http://www.madbeanpedals.com/forum/index.php?topic=12089.0 (http://www.madbeanpedals.com/forum/index.php?topic=12089.0)