I was working on a build today that called for a 320k resistor, which is not very common, so I didn't have one. I decided I would measure through my 330k resistors and see if one came close, only to discover they all would not register at all on my meter. Well, they would register around half of 330 for a split second, then go to 1, indicating no measurement. I tested other resistors (from mouser) and they were fine, ruling out a bad meter. So, once again, you get what you pay for, kids. Now I will test every blasted one of them before I use them until theyre gone, then no more Tayda resistors for me.
Update: It turns out it was my cheapo multimeter. Into the bin with it!
Quote from: AntKnee on February 03, 2017, 02:51:02 AM
Now I will test every blasted one of them before I use them until theyre gone, then no more Tayda resistors for me.
I highly recommend you just throw them away now and replace them with decent stuff. It's not worth the headache. I don't know your finances, but I can't see it being worth it. And if you are in a bad spot, PM me and I'll send you some resistors.
Were the other resistors that you tested high values, like > 200 K ? With my cheap DVM, it can give wonky values on the highest resistance range, especially if the battery is running down. I'm not sure of a mechanism for a resistor going bad with the behavior you're describing (low value then open circuit).
IME resistors from Tayda have been fine. Do people really see failed resistors often? I understand that some of their more sensitive components may be an issue - like out of spec FETs or ICs - but I've seen a lot of threads where someone tears apart a circuit in search of faulty components and eventually finds a connection that was unsoldered all along. I've done this myself.
I always test every resistor, cap, diode and transistor. It doesn't add that much time and it's so much easier to solve the problem than after it's in-circuit. With pedals, the part count is pretty small so it shouldn't take too long. I socket ICs so they can be swapped out fairly easily.
Quote from: reddesert on February 03, 2017, 04:35:14 AM
Were the other resistors that you tested high values, like > 200 K ? With my cheap DVM, it can give wonky values on the highest resistance range, especially if the battery is running down. I'm not sure of a mechanism for a resistor going bad with the behavior you're describing (low value then open circuit).
Actually, the ones that tested weird were 330k and the ones I tested that worked were 100k. I just pulled out a 390k from Mouser and it tested weird, too. So I guess it is my DVM after all. Its a cheap beginner meter and I'm due for a nice one, anyway. Thanks for bringing that up. I'll retest some resistors when I get a new meter and see what happens.
Yeah when it comes to dirt-cheap components like resistors and non electrolytic caps, I don't see any reason not to just buy them in the hundreds from mouser/digikey. Still only pennies (or even less), and you'll know you should be able to trust them.
Quote from: EBRAddict on February 03, 2017, 01:55:27 PM
I always test every resistor, cap, diode and transistor. It doesn't add that much time and it's so much easier to solve the problem than after it's in-circuit.
i never do because i'm really lazy. how often would you say that you have averted a problem by doing this?
Quote from: stecykmi on February 03, 2017, 06:47:14 PM
Quote from: EBRAddict on February 03, 2017, 01:55:27 PM
I always test every resistor, cap, diode and transistor. It doesn't add that much time and it's so much easier to solve the problem than after it's in-circuit.
i never do because i'm really lazy. how often would you say that you have averted a problem by doing this?
I do the same thing. I test everything before I start. I use some foam strips, bend the resistors/diodes and line them up on one side and the capacitors on the other and run the lines testing. It takes a few minutes to do it and I dont have to look at the build doc again until after all that is soldered. I don't know how many times it has saved me from jacking something up but at least I know everything was right when placed on the board. It saved me from putting a couple of bad Tayda elec caps in. That stopped me from buying caps from Tayda. I still occasionally get their resistors if I am running low on a certain value and I am ordering pots/boxes.
What multimeter do you plan on getting? I too, only have a cheap thing that doesn't work all too well. I've been meaning to upgrade as well, but I can't tell what sets all the various models apart.
I've been using this multimeter for quite a while now and so far it's been great. I couldn't afford a Fluke and did some research before I settled on this one. No complaints, especially for the low cost.
https://www.amazon.com/AideTek-VC97-Multimeter-Capacitor-Frequency/dp/B008GTEZPI/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1486161905&sr=8-6&keywords=aidetek (https://www.amazon.com/AideTek-VC97-Multimeter-Capacitor-Frequency/dp/B008GTEZPI/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1486161905&sr=8-6&keywords=aidetek)
Quote from: stecykmi on February 03, 2017, 06:47:14 PM
Quote from: EBRAddict on February 03, 2017, 01:55:27 PM
I always test every resistor, cap, diode and transistor. It doesn't add that much time and it's so much easier to solve the problem than after it's in-circuit.
i never do because i'm really lazy. how often would you say that you have averted a problem by doing this?
Not often I'd say I've found at least one thing iffy or wrong out of every 10 pedals I built. Caps out of spec, a vendor shipped a MOSFET instead of a BJT, or a wrong resistor value, or a BJT with a gain too low, shit germanium diodes. For me that helps knowing the problem is likely with my soldering or wiring.
please, before you say parts are faulty from certain sites please triple check things over, I'm not having a go at you it's just that it can be detrimental to some sellers of pedal parts. :-)
Ironically I have this thing
http://www.taydaelectronics.com/esr-meter-transistor-tester-lcd-diode-multimeter-capacitance.html
It works well for caps and resistors, not sure I totally trust it in trannies though.
Quote from: chordball on February 03, 2017, 10:47:23 PM
I've been using this multimeter for quite a while now and so far it's been great. I couldn't afford a Fluke and did some research before I settled on this one. No complaints, especially for the low cost.
https://www.amazon.com/AideTek-VC97-Multimeter-Capacitor-Frequency/dp/B008GTEZPI/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1486161905&sr=8-6&keywords=aidetek (https://www.amazon.com/AideTek-VC97-Multimeter-Capacitor-Frequency/dp/B008GTEZPI/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1486161905&sr=8-6&keywords=aidetek)
Does this DMM read transistor hfe very well? I picked up a super cheap DMM from harbor freight but it's terrible at reading hfe.
When you put the transistor in the socket, it doesn't read it unless you wiggle it a lot and get lucky. Even then, the reading is all over the place.
I have a similar harbor freight DMM and the problem is that actually getting the transistor leads down to whatever the test contacts are is pretty difficult. It feels like there is not a socket there, or that getting the leads into the socket is difficult. Pre-bending the leads may help, or maybe sticking wires into the test contact and to a breadboard if you were going to test many transistors. Once it makes good contact, the h_FE number is fairly stable and agrees with specs.
On the one hand, the meter is kinda crappy in the details, and on the other, it cost $3.99! I'm amazed at what you can get now. The first effect I built was strictly out of parts available from Radio Shack, and I had to walk uphill both ways to get there ...
All of my resistors are Tayda, and they've gone in everything from Moog 960 clones to LaVache pedals.
I was worried in the extreme when I saw that subject line.
I've used many, many resistors from Tayda and never had a problem.
Once you get used to the thinner leads, they're really just like any other resistor.
I am sorry if I caused any offense or concern regarding parts. I did do what I thought was a good double check with known good parts. Under the circumstances, it truly appeared to me that I had bad parts. I don't have the experience with problems of this nature to know that a cheap meter could work fine with some resistors and not work with others. I assumed it would either work, or not work, with any resistor. So, it seemed perfectly logical to conclude the resistors were bad. That was my mistake.
Now worries man. It's clearned up and we all learned something.
I'll compare the transistor tester on the multimeter to my other tester and report back. I've never used the one on the multimeter since I had the other one.
I use a DCA75 and a small DIY rig to test through hole transistors. Between the 0.05, 0.1 and ZIF socket I can burn through a pile of transistors pretty quickly.
(http://i65.tinypic.com/2e2j9zb.jpg)
I made a little resistor tester out of some Envirotex and a couple paper clips.
(http://i1254.photobucket.com/albums/hh606/bcalla44/Testing%20Rig/Resistor%20Tester_zpsqrb5vbkq.jpg~original)
That paper clip resistor cradle is brilliant! Wished I'd thought of it. I hate troubleshooting so I measure all my resistors as I populate the board. It has reduced my box of fail ratio to near zilch.
I picked up a gizmo similar to the Tayda one and can't believe how accurate it is. At least with resistors. I scored mine on eBay for $12 after reading a post from Pink Jimi Photon. I have no idea how they can pull that off, I'd think the zif socket alone would cost that much. I mounted it to a bit of wood to give it a bit more heft so I don't break it.
(http://www.gordomusic.com/Madbean/GDP001.jpg)
(http://www.gordomusic.com/Madbean/GDP002.jpg)
(http://www.gordomusic.com/Madbean/GDP003.jpg)
I ended up doing the same with my Delyk test rig. Keeps it stable on the bench and I don't have to worry about plugging something into the wrong terminal.
(http://www.gordomusic.com/Madbean/GDP004.jpg)
Guts go right from the rig to the box. Here's a gratuitous shot of the freshly minted AquaBoy with the Mod board.
(http://www.gordomusic.com/Madbean/GDP005.jpg)
That resistor tester of bcalla is awesome!!
A good quality dvm is well worth its price. I fortunately work in a career where I need to have a good meter (or two) So that translates well to my hobbies also. I have a $60 esi meter at home for building stuff which works ok but, I bring my fluke home quite often too. There is little comparison between the two. For $150 (maybe less used) you can pick up a new fluke meter. I don't know of anything better, pretty much an industry standard.
Quote from: chordball on February 03, 2017, 10:47:23 PM
I've been using this multimeter for quite a while now and so far it's been great. I couldn't afford a Fluke and did some research before I settled on this one. No complaints, especially for the low cost.
https://www.amazon.com/AideTek-VC97-Multimeter-Capacitor-Frequency/dp/B008GTEZPI/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1486161905&sr=8-6&keywords=aidetek (https://www.amazon.com/AideTek-VC97-Multimeter-Capacitor-Frequency/dp/B008GTEZPI/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1486161905&sr=8-6&keywords=aidetek)
I have the same meter and it has been fine. Not the best but totally functional.
Quote from: gordo on February 05, 2017, 02:38:56 AM
That paper clip resistor cradle is brilliant! Wished I'd thought of it. I hate troubleshooting so I measure all my resistors as I populate the board. It has reduced my box of fail ratio to near zilch.
I picked up a gizmo similar to the Tayda one and can't believe how accurate it is. At least with resistors. I scored mine on eBay for $12 after reading a post from Pink Jimi Photon. I have no idea how they can pull that off, I'd think the zif socket alone would cost that much. I mounted it to a bit of wood to give it a bit more heft so I don't break it.
(http://www.gordomusic.com/Madbean/GDP001.jpg)
(http://www.gordomusic.com/Madbean/GDP002.jpg)
(http://www.gordomusic.com/Madbean/GDP003.jpg)
I ended up doing the same with my Delyk test rig. Keeps it stable on the bench and I don't have to worry about plugging something into the wrong terminal.
(http://www.gordomusic.com/Madbean/GDP004.jpg)
Guts go right from the rig to the box. Here's a gratuitous shot of the freshly minted AquaBoy with the Mod board.
(http://www.gordomusic.com/Madbean/GDP005.jpg)
any chance you have links to the resistor/ transistor tester and the test rig? thanks!
Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
Rule of thumb, if your multimeter has a transistor-testing socket, it's probably too cheap. ;)
(actually not a joke. the two come hand-in-hand more often than not)
Quote from: cloudscapes on February 06, 2017, 09:51:44 PM
Rule of thumb, if your multimeter has a transistor-testing socket, it's probably too cheap. ;)
(actually not a joke. the two come hand-in-hand more often than not)
So true...
Seems they try to pack as many "features" as possible into the cheapest of test gear.... ::)
OTOH.... I have a (relatively) expensive older-ish Digi-Log meter that has a hfe tester.... and I still don't trust it. (shrug)
Just an update for anyone still interested. I did get a decent multimeter and the components read just fine now. I tested 330k resistors and they were consistently reading 329.5, so no complaints there. I didn't go crazy, spent about $25 on something that works for my use. I don't need a Fluke or anything crazy just for testing components and trouble shooting.
I do have the links. The test rig is our own daleykd and this website is https://pcb.delyk.com. I noticed the full kit (I got lazy and went that route - very recommended for instant gratification) is currently out of stock.
The gizmo: http://stores.ebay.com/frentaly?_trksid=p2047675.l2563
Poor AntKnee :-) you took a lashing on this one dude. Glad you got it all worked out though so no worries. I wish I had a nickel for every Tayda critique I've read, yet we all still use them for something. I've had very few problems so took your situation with a grain of salt AND it's always possible to get into a bad run of product from ANYone.
thanks @gordo... i'll be ordering one of those neat little do-dads soon!
i've been working on a pig butt build that is rapidly eroding my confidence in my abilities and figured that i should probably invest in some testing tools to avoid issues in the future... as for the audio probe/test rig, i have a JMK pcb for the test rig that i need to build... i'm definitely going to look into the delyk one as well.
my prob is with the leads. They are soo damn thin it drives me crazy, i was saying earlier htat i wish they would carry some with thicker leads, so at least i could have a semi one stop shop that didnt break my bank. I respect small bear alot, and have ordered from them many times when i could have gotten twice the product from tayda, but to me piece of mind is worth paying for, bc when shit dont work when you finish your build ive found i have had a harder time troubleshooting parts from Tayda than SB, At least mammoth has 55 cent pots now that ppl have basically confirmed that they are alphas but just branded mammoth that it hardly makes sense to me to even order from tayda anymore. I added 20 pots to basket and it qouted me at 3.65 3 day shipping from mammoth. But i live 300 miles away, but i doubt it could cost but couple buck more if you were in NYC or something.
Culture Jam where do you get your resistors? Small bear is a good deal but to really stock up seems like youd have to spend at least 50-75 bucks, i cant afford to spend but like 20 bucks here and there. I know metal film is the big thing, but idc as long as the leads are decent thickness and tolerance isnt too bad.