Hello guys, I am trying to get that 1973 live Jimmy page tone (biting crushing distortion). I have the Les paul, a good Marshall 100W clone, and a killer 4x12 but what about the fuzz?
1. Is a tonebender what I need?
2. If so, which version?
3. What kind of Tranny gains am I looking for?
4. Could I build an NPN version and use something like CV7112's?
Hey Shawnee I too have been chasing this tone since Bonzo died.
What do you think about this:
It has a silicon IC chip. He makes things sound good in the video but I wonder about real life.
If I get a round to buying a CA3086 I might build one.
Man that sounds pretty dang good Steve. I had never heard of this pedal so thank you for that. It isn't quite as crushing as Page's tone on "the ocean" live in 1973 but it's a pretty legit Page tone for sure. I may have to build this one too.
There was a whole lotta trouble with that FX company over at FSB. I personally wouln't buy one because of LK's attitude towards DIY builders/the whole FSB fiasco. A Tonebender is what you are looking for, BYOC ESV 2 knob Bender was one of my first builds and it does that sort of tone very well.
Haha, yeah good ol' Lancey pants had to try and ruin it for everyone. I would stay away from retro channel's gear. You could build a "The Fuzz" yourself ;D
Thanks for the warning guys. I found a nice schematic for an NPN 2 knob tonebender that I may build. I am exploring good tranny options at smallbear right now.
Is the Pastyface the same think as the MKII Page used (with a tone knob) or is it a different animal?
If so, how do people like the Pastyface?
I'm debating about building that next or a Cosmopolitan.
The Pastyface is essentially the Fulltone Soul Bender, which is essentially a Tonebender Mk3.
Worth building. It's my favourite Tonebender I've built. Though I'm about to get to try a buzz around (bumblebee).
Jacob
Quote from: JakeFuzz on January 22, 2012, 01:18:41 AM
Haha, yeah good ol' Lancey pants had to try and ruin it for everyone. I would stay away from retro channel's gear. You could build a "The Fuzz" yourself ;D
Ha! Lancey-pants... I love it!
Well I just traded a Dan Zink Bit-O-Honey(and $25) to Nick Sterling for his Retro Channel "The Fuzz". I am not having a lot of luck with my fuzz building for some reason (except for the Cosmopolitan which is AMAZING). Nick is really nice guy.
Ah the Tonbender... A pedal of much contention. DAM are seen as turning out the best 'real' tonebender clones. It was all about the OC81D aparenetly, until he ran out of usable ones of those, I think now he's using the OC84... Filled with mojo goodness on vero.
The thing is, he certainly makes them well, and I've just knocked an OC84 one together using his layout and mojo components and it's shockingly good... Which irritates me. Much better than the BYOC one I made back in the past. I suspect a lot of it comes down to snagging good trannies in a good range with little leakage. These seems to be a good rule of thumb anyhow:
Q1 - 70-85hfe
Q2 - 70-85hfe
Q3 - 110-140hfe
Leakage below 200uA
If you want to make a silicon tonbender, the Doug Hammond's Hot Silicon is the way forward. Brilliant fuzz. Responds well to different transistors also. Barry does a board for it (http://www.guitarpcb.com/apps/webstore/products/show/1259536) or you can make it on vero (http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/ulysses/ulysses_layouts/dh_hot_silicon/). Works nice with a SHO following it also which thickens it up nicely. As a bonus, it doesn't need temperature protection... ;)
Quote from: timbo_93631 on January 22, 2012, 01:10:49 AM
There was a whole lotta trouble with that FX company over at FSB. I personally wouln't buy one because of LK's attitude towards DIY builders/the whole FSB fiasco. A Tonebender is what you are looking for, BYOC ESV 2 knob Bender was one of my first builds and it does that sort of tone very well.
the esv bender was the 1st pedal I ever built. and it is a fantastic sounding project. tons of output, and has a edgier dirtier grind to it, compared to a mkIII variant.
Did some fuzz building last week: another run at the neutrino which always gives me trouble, a retrobush fuzz and mictesters silicon fuzz but won't test them for a while because I'm short some pots, one resistor, and most importantly time.
Shawnee how do you like the retro channel fuzz?
I don't have it yet. He is shipping tomorrow so it will probably be towards the end of the week when I get t. I will report back when I get it.
A lot of the online buzz suggests Page wasn't using a Tonebender at all by '73, particularly live. People who spend lots of time discussing such matters (think TGP!) say he had mods done to his Marshalls to incorporate some kind of top end boost such as he had gotten from the preamp on the Echoplex. See the Lumpy's Tone Shop '73 Boost for more info.
But a Tonebender is a hell of a lot more fun, isn't it? :) For me, I'd prefer start with a good fuzz since I'll never have access to Page's modded amps anyway. I got a Ghost Effects Buzzaround over the summer and actually found I could get great tones for "Communication Breakdown"--granted, it's in that Tonebender family, but you get the idea. If the particular piece of gear gets you "there" and you're having fun no matter whether a particular player used it, you're on the right track!
Wow, I had too much coffee this morning or something! Sorry for the punditry. Good luck on your build--I'd love to try out one of the Small Bear tranny sets at some point as well...
LOL, I love coffee.
Yeah I could be way off but the 1973 live Page tone sounds like a les paul through a Rangemaster into a cranked Marshall to me. Just a hint of germanium squish in there...........
I am really on a quest to capture certain classic dirty sounds: Marshall (my modded boneyard nails it), Fender Tweed ala Keith Richards (La Vache works well), Billy Gibbons (Cosmopolitan through an almost clean Marshall), and now it's on to Jimmy Page, Jimi Hendrix, and Eric Johnson.
I don't think you're far off at all, actually! I think that boost circuit he allegedly had built into his Marshalls (the Echoplex one) wasn't germanium based, but Page, Blackmore and others do seem to have thought of these tape delay preamps as a variant of the treble booster theme.
Hey, I notice Madbean's Fat Pants boost is based on this kind of circuit. I wonder if that would get you in the ballpark? I'm sure a Rangemaster wouldn't disappoint either.
I'm glad to hear your Cosmopolitan gets you in Billy Gibbons territory--I'm gearing up to build mine and would love if it could do that for me!
Hey, I thought of another reputable builder chasing those '73-era live Page tones in addition to Lumpy's Tone Shop. Earthquaker Device's Chrysalis is a transistor-based OD going for those sounds. Looks to be SI transistor-based from the gut shots I saw...
Cheers,
Bret
I built the fatpants but havn't played with it lately. I'll A/B it with the Rangemaster.
Yeah a slightly overdriven Marshall type amp with the Cosmo is sick! ZZ Top for days!
Lots of cool pedals out there these days. There are some great youtube vids on the Lumpy's fuzz boxes.
here's a great demo j. santiago did on how to get eric johnson's sound with 3 different gear setups. the first 2 sound really close the 3rd...not so much. It really helped me with getting that tone. it's his ah via musicom era tone,http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OtI5UWAQXLg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OtI5UWAQXLg)
Yeah that's a great EJ tone vid.
I got the Retro channel Fuzz in. It sounds good but I wasn't knocked out by it. It's fairly bright and a little splatty. Decent midrange but no very round on the bottom. My Cosmopolitan build just kills it since there is so much control.
Quote from: shawnee on March 04, 2012, 04:59:22 AM
Yeah that's a great EJ tone vid.
I got the Retro channel Fuzz in. It sounds good but I wasn't knocked out by it. It's fairly bright and a little splatty. Decent midrange but no very round on the bottom. My Cosmopolitan build just kills it since there is so much control.
Build a Hot Silicon and experiment with different trannies in it. Stick a SHO on the end of it to thicken it. It's really very good and certainly worth a build.
Thanks Juansolo. I'll check into that.