madbeanpedals::forum

Projects => Build Reports => Topic started by: alanp on December 15, 2013, 12:54:40 AM

Title: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: alanp on December 15, 2013, 12:54:40 AM
What can I say, I'm a sick man.

Lacesensor approached me to design another Doppelganger board for him, since he had ticking problems with the 1.4 board. Sure, I say. (You'll have to ask Lace for one of these purring jaguars. I did the boards for him, so he's got the say on where they go. The 1.4 boards are still shared on OSH -- they had no issues for me, but some people did have ticking problems.)

This is the result.

(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t282/Gutstwohand/dop21guts_zps9ae7b206.jpg) (http://s163.photobucket.com/user/Gutstwohand/media/dop21guts_zps9ae7b206.jpg.html)

(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t282/Gutstwohand/dop21box_zpsba1150b3.jpg) (http://s163.photobucket.com/user/Gutstwohand/media/dop21box_zpsba1150b3.jpg.html)

Exactly the same electrically as the 1.4 layout shared on OSHpark, just with pads for the Lovetone layout. This layout can be done with the 1.4 board, if you have patience for flying wires.

9mm board mounted pots, pads for three stomp switches (Dual, Bypass, and Phase/Vib), plus I included the Lovetone spectral/true bypass switch. In this enclosure, I had room for all the jacks. In, Out, Pedal1, Pedal2, and Dry. 1790NS. I could probably have put the power jack at the top, I just don't trust my metalwork that much. I used 2k span pots for this one. I'm actually quite proud of how tidy the wiring worked out :D I used a mix of Smallbear #22 brown that I'm trying to use up, and Chromesphere's wire from his webstore, which is quite nice to work with, way more flexible than the Smallbear #24.

Serendipitously, I had a few low profile jacks lying around. Annoyingly, I only had two 3PDT stomps, but that turned out to be a blessing in disguise when I found a DPDT stomp at the bottom of one of the mixed parts bags. Combined, they worked nicely in the limited space In jack area.
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: muddyfox on December 15, 2013, 02:29:46 AM
The 1.4 boards are still shared on OSH -- they had no issues for me, but some people did have ticking problems.)

As I still have your unpopulated 1.4 board I was actually wondering about all the reported ticking and whether to hold on until someone figures out the way to tame it, but I'm gonna have a go at it nevertheless. Who knows, I'm not usually the lucky one but this just may work.

Great job on the new layout, if this ever resurfaces I'll give it a go for sure.
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: the3secondrule on December 15, 2013, 04:04:40 AM
I've built 2 of the v1.4 boards with no ticking.

The 1.4 boards are still shared on OSH -- they had no issues for me, but some people did have ticking problems.)

As I still have your unpopulated 1.4 board I was actually wondering about all the reported ticking and whether to hold on until someone figures out the way to tame it, but I'm gonna have a go at it nevertheless. Who knows, I'm not usually the lucky one but this just may work.

Great job on the new layout, if this ever resurfaces I'll give it a go for sure.
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: the3secondrule on December 15, 2013, 04:06:28 AM
any chance on you (or Lace) sharing the layout on oshpark>

Cheeers

What can I say, I'm a sick man.

Lacesensor approached me to design another Doppelganger board for him, since he had ticking problems with the 1.4 board. Sure, I say. (You'll have to ask Lace for one of these purring jaguars. I did the boards for him, so he's got the say on where they go. The 1.4 boards are still shared on OSH -- they had no issues for me, but some people did have ticking problems.)

This is the result.

(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t282/Gutstwohand/dop21guts_zps9ae7b206.jpg) (http://s163.photobucket.com/user/Gutstwohand/media/dop21guts_zps9ae7b206.jpg.html)

(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t282/Gutstwohand/dop21box_zpsba1150b3.jpg) (http://s163.photobucket.com/user/Gutstwohand/media/dop21box_zpsba1150b3.jpg.html)

Exactly the same electrically as the 1.4 layout shared on OSHpark, just with pads for the Lovetone layout. This layout can be done with the 1.4 board, if you have patience for flying wires.

9mm board mounted pots, pads for three stomp switches (Dual, Bypass, and Phase/Vib), plus I included the Lovetone spectral/true bypass switch. In this enclosure, I had room for all the jacks. In, Out, Pedal1, Pedal2, and Dry. 1790NS. I could probably have put the power jack at the top, I just don't trust my metalwork that much. I used 2k span pots for this one. I'm actually quite proud of how tidy the wiring worked out :D I used a mix of Smallbear #22 brown that I'm trying to use up, and Chromesphere's wire from his webstore, which is quite nice to work with, way more flexible than the Smallbear #24.

Serendipitously, I had a few low profile jacks lying around. Annoyingly, I only had two 3PDT stomps, but that turned out to be a blessing in disguise when I found a DPDT stomp at the bottom of one of the mixed parts bags. Combined, they worked nicely in the limited space In jack area.
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: stecykmi on December 15, 2013, 01:02:52 PM
ya i wouldn't mind getting my hands on one of these... really nice work!
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: jimilee on December 15, 2013, 01:07:27 PM
So I'm curious, and we've had the discussion, but for those of you with the ticking issues, where did your optical resistors come from?
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: muddyfox on December 15, 2013, 02:03:14 PM

I'm really looking forward to my 1.4 build, with all the ticking issues reported. I have a bunch of ebay ldrs of values right and wrong to try out...
I just can't seem to find the time....
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: LaceSensor on December 15, 2013, 06:07:42 PM
So I'm curious, and we've had the discussion, but for those of you with the ticking issues, where did your optical resistors come from?

Futurec
The same I've used in the original full size clone I reversed, then the 1.4 then the version 2s that I commission from Alan. It's not a optocoupler issue in my opinion...
It's more likely toed to the layout.
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: LaceSensor on December 15, 2013, 06:09:40 PM
For other folk there might be a limited run of pcbs in the new year but the project won't be on oshpark sorry.

There are 2 great projects out there already from Alan ( v1.4 ) and myself ( full size copy of the original).
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: juansolo on December 16, 2013, 09:41:57 AM
So I'm curious, and we've had the discussion, but for those of you with the ticking issues, where did your optical resistors come from?

Futurec
The same I've used in the original full size clone I reversed, then the 1.4 then the version 2s that I commission from Alan. It's not a optocoupler issue in my opinion...
It's more likely toed to the layout.

yeah we tried all sorts with two separate builds and gave in trying to de-tick it in then end. shame.
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: Govmnt_Lacky on December 16, 2013, 10:00:17 AM
Might be a stupid or already asked question but.....

I am assuming that the original full-sized layout had no ticking issues correct? Otherwise, it would never have been brought to market.

So... is this just a result of "condensing" the original layout to smaller sizes? Could this be cause by a closer proximity of the LED/LDRs? Has anyone tried building this with the LED/LDRs encased in something to shield the pairs from ambient light created by the "closer" LED/LDR pairs?
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: LaceSensor on December 16, 2013, 12:30:47 PM
Might be a stupid or already asked question but.....

I am assuming that the original full-sized layout had no ticking issues correct? Otherwise, it would never have been brought to market.

So... is this just a result of "condensing" the original layout to smaller sizes? Could this be cause by a closer proximity of the LED/LDRs? Has anyone tried building this with the LED/LDRs encased in something to shield the pairs from ambient light created by the "closer" LED/LDR pairs?

This board 2.1 does not tick
The original lovetone does not tick. My project which is basically copying that does not tick. None of those designs need shielded LDRs. In the original lovetone the LDRs are about as close as in this 2.1 version.

The 1.4 version differs in two ways. The Audio and CV sides of the circuit are more "overlapping" due to the 1590BB footprint. I spec'd with Alan that this 2.1 board would have separate audio and CV like the original lovetone layout.
The other way the 1.4 version differs is it is wired for True bypass only, as doesnt use the lovetone buffered bypass setup.
What impact that has, I do not know, but there are the details.

Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: jimilee on December 16, 2013, 12:53:24 PM
Alan said that his build didn't tick when he built it. Have you guys speculated as to why everyone Else's did? I am working on the 1.4 now, but again am leary about it. Has anyone successfully built it?
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: LaceSensor on December 16, 2013, 03:41:51 PM
Alan said that his build didn't tick when he built it. Have you guys speculated as to why everyone Else's did? I am working on the 1.4 now, but again am leary about it. Has anyone successfully built it?

Read above.

The3secondrule and Alanp both made the 1.4 and didnt have ticking.
Right now a commonality to me and Juan is the fact we are in the UK (if that makes any difference, but i doubt it)
Other than that we both tried various things to get rid of the tick and couldn't.

Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: jimilee on December 16, 2013, 03:56:59 PM
I was wondering if that would make the difference
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: alanp on December 16, 2013, 10:03:16 PM
I used Smallbear 27k-60k / 2meg LDR's, while Juan and Lace used Futurlec 2A's. That's the only difference I'm aware of.
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: jimilee on December 16, 2013, 10:05:20 PM
Yeah, you and I talked once before. I am forging ahead, and I also have the small bear parts. I'm optimistic.
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: Scruffie on December 16, 2013, 10:10:26 PM
The LED is more likely to lead to ticking than the LDRs by drawing more current.

Did anyone try lifting the LFO chip above ground?

Nice new layout though  :)
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: juansolo on December 17, 2013, 03:40:17 AM
Used other LDRs in Cleggys and it made no odds.  Cleggy hacked around with his (Lace's old one) trying to separate the sides of the circuit and managed to cut the tick in half I'd say. But it was still there. It must be something in the water here ;)

Lace's big 'un doesn't tick at all. Still got another one of those to build at some point for MrC.
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: agoldoor on December 30, 2013, 02:19:22 PM
Well if y'all decide to sell a PCB for this, I'd definitely be in... jus' sayin'
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: sonarchotic on December 30, 2013, 05:15:34 PM
Super impressive Alan! I just had my first go at Eagle and was all proud of my booster. Was :D
Title: Re: Doppelganger 2.1
Post by: alanp on December 30, 2013, 10:09:58 PM
That's up to Lace :)

Sonarchotic, I was working on getting a bloody reverb board working for the last couple weeks, on and off (more off if I'm honest.) Only got the mongrel thing working last night (and I laid out the board!)