Is it me or does anyone else feel that DIY pedal building is kinda dropping off. Don't get me wrong there are still quite a few of us hardcore guys at it all the time but I am seeing less builds and less chatter about builds across all the forums.
What are your thoughts?
Well I just had an almost three year break with very little building and stuff and being absent, just got back into it.
It feels similar to me, compared to what I remember. I don't know much about other forums, I'm just mainly active here.
Would be interested to hear other peeps opinions too.
Quote from: cooder on June 20, 2018, 04:21:02 PM
Well I just had an almost three year break with very little building and stuff and being absent, just got back into it.
It feels similar to me, compared to what I remember. I don't know much about other forums, I'm just mainly active here.
Would be interested to hear other peeps opinions too.
Welcome back to the building. I think the ability to make vintage pedals, well known pedals and the obscure is just mind blowing really. Pedals I've just not had the cash to get years ago I have been able to make and to me it's a rewarding thing.
I don't think there's a decline, just a shift. Guys like myself have built a ton of pedals and there isn't anything new or exciting in analog. The shift has moved to fv-1 stuff. For a while it was smd.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I think it's pretty active, maybe more so than before. I suspect it's a bigger community than we think. For each of us that's active here or some other forum there's probably several that are just building and not active online.
I think there is such a wealth of knowledge available these days that people don't have to dig hard for.
Quote from: jimilee on June 20, 2018, 05:39:20 PM
I don't think there's a decline, just a shift. Guys like myself have built a ton of pedals and there isn't anything new or exciting in analog. The shift has moved to fv-1 stuff. For a while it was smd.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
This is pretty much what i have noticed too. I expressed my distaste for the FV-1 many times. I fell like it makes the hobby seem cheap or easy. Don't get me wrong people do some amazing stuff with the FV-1 (for example drolo), I just think it lessens the experience when you can solder a chip onto a PCB and program it with what ever effect you want. but that may just be me.
Yeah I would actually say the opposite. I also find that I sort of create my own atmosphere, in down times I think perhaps everything is slowing down in the diy world. But its not, its just my own input to it.
At the moment im pretty active, I have tonnes of new stuff coming up, everything gets busier, so to me, at the moment, it feels the opposite.
What is actually happening in the diy community I don't know. I don't detect a slower pace though, community wise, there still seems to be just as much interest as always.
I'd say that there's a different vibe elsewhere ... go join a diy pedal or amp group on fb and its "look at me! look what I can do!" whereas I'd say its a little more subdued on forums.
It always goes through slow phases. Plus people's interests diverge after awhile (how many overdrives you need, anyway?)
weird but as a newcomer (only been at it for a year or so) i feel like FV-1 has been massively unexplored and is quite dormant for how much potential is there. compared to things like belton brick and PT2399.
Quote from: jimilee on June 20, 2018, 05:39:20 PM
I don't think there's a decline, just a shift. Guys like myself have built a ton of pedals and there isn't anything new or exciting in analog. The shift has moved to fv-1 stuff. For a while it was smd.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I have seen and built some FV-1 projects from pedal pcb, but where is the rest of that development there (since I missed that being out of the building...).
Quote from: Matmosphere on June 20, 2018, 05:59:25 PM
I think it's pretty active, maybe more so than before. I suspect it's a bigger community than we think. For each of us that's active here or some other forum there's probably several that are just building and not active online.
I think there is such a wealth of knowledge available these days that people don't have to dig hard for.
Yes it seems there's a bunch of guest on the forum site but fewer active members and fewer build reports and new design things happening?! At least my feeling...
Is it more a consumer attitude rather than participating and joining actively?
Quote from: thesmokingman on June 20, 2018, 07:06:30 PM
I'd say that there's a different vibe elsewhere ... go join a diy pedal or amp group on fb and its "look at me! look what I can do!" whereas I'd say its a little more subdued on forums.
Seems that is a bit of the effect of less committed realm like facebook versus shaping and taking an active part in a forum.
If it feels like pedal DIY is in decline, my guess is it's just a temporary slowdown.
There's no shortage of pedal demos on youtube or new pedal companies popping up.
As long as pedals are being sold, there'll be a healthy DIY scene.
For me personally, I've been building synth things and I've just started a kit guitar build. Very excited about that.
I'll post some pics in the guitar building section when I've got some news. There'll be a big gap though between
clear coating and assembly. I don't want to buff out the clear lacquer until it's nice and dry.
I'm sorta feeling like there isn't really that much left I'm interested in doing. Like some one said - how many ODs do you want (all of them is the answer), and once you've built the classic effects (CE-2, some sort of delay, whatever), I feel like there's not that much more for me personally.
Even the output at tagboard and the associated forums has slowed down.
I've got 3 FV-1 pcbs for my next multi, and a couple more dirts to build, and or box, but I feel like I'm coming to the end of the road. At least building other peoples stuff. Maybe it'll lead to me finally putting together the ultimate OD and becoming famous while everyone else clones the pcb or builds a vero of it, but I doubt it.
There have been a number of threads about this in the past couple of years.
I think DIY is still active, but a lot of the long term members (myself included) have simply built so much over the years that there's a nature ebb and flow to the building. I build less for myself than I used to because the need isn't really there as much anymore. I do still enjoy building for myself for the fun of it, though.
I also think that, in the past, some folks got into DIY in the first place in an attempt to save money vs. buying new pedals. These days, there are so many inexpensive pedals coming out of China that it isn't really necessary to build them if you are on a budget. I still think there's value in building, but the financial push that helps people get into it isn't there as much. I suspect that the key to a healthy community in the future is finding a way to cultivate new builders that haven't reached that taper off point of building like a bunch of us old timers have.
(from the guy who hasn't made a single pedal building comment in a couple of years)
I would also vote that it's a shift. When I started in this, err, 7 (?) years ago, it was build everything. Hell, I didn't even know if I liked BMPs (turns out not really a huge fan), but I'm pretty certain I built every single perfboard and fabboard variant thereof (didn't box them all, but that's strictly an economics decision). If I had to guess, I'd say I've boxed somewhere between 100 - 150 pedals, of which when I was playing I probably used 20 in rotation.
I've been on a break for a couple of years now, moreso because of things outside of the music related world. I still intend to get back into it, I still have at least 70 boards to complete. It will probably get done in time, but there's no rush, it's a hobby.
Quote from: Willybomb on June 21, 2018, 04:16:07 AM
Even the output at tagboard and the associated forums has slowed down.
Mirosol slowed the pace (almost completely stopped) a few years back because of health issues. Even then there were close to a thousand layouts on there, with that much done the work of finding schematics for pedals that are worth doing that anyone would build probably takes longer than the layouts themselves.
In terms of sales, I'm certain many of the PCB guys around here would confirm that there are fewer sales now than 3-4 years ago, but I can't tell if that's because of a slow down or because of a larger variety of sellers and options available. When I started, it was Tonepad, or BYOC, and maybe one or two other options. I remember as the tap-tempo tremolo was developed, and then the Echobase, and I know CJ put out a Muff, and Brian had his Aquaboy layout.
A lot of things changed when Brian started Madbean, and then it got even better when he switched from Etched single side PCBs to manufactured ones. I think Barry did the etched boards as well, and also switched to manufactured boards eventually as well (they were terrible because of the pad sizes). I joined in making boards of my own shortly after, because Brian had coached me quite a bit in PCB design. Then slowly more and more manufacturers joined us here, like Josh and Thomas, etc. That was the golden era right there, with the most involvement and new builders. Lots of us were building at a frenetic pace. It began to slow down, and now, there are a bunch of PCB sellers that are only loosely associated here, and now there are tonnes more options of PCBs, and several designs for the same circuit out there, and most of the places to buy stuff also now sell kits for PCBs from a variety of sources. When I started 10ish years ago, the only manufactured Tubescreamer you could buy was from Tonepad, unless you wanted the kit version from BYOC. Now, I bet you there's dozens of them out there.
I did my youtube series on using Eagle, and someone told me it was a huge mistake because now anyone can do what the PCB guys do with a little time an effort. I say the more the merrier, but it has made it so that there are guys out there who are likely completely solo now, and don't utilize any forum, because they are building their own layouts and using Laen's old service (now called OshPark) and choose to interact on the more convenient social media sites to show and promote what they're doing.
I suspect Pedal building will always be a thing, but we went through a boom a number of years ago, and now we're in a plateau era. It's alright, and I still build the occasional pedal. I just wish I had more time to devote to developing new circuits and release more layouts.
Jacob
Here's something that did change:
FSB stopped buying and tracing the latest and greatest and chasiest pedals, because builders stopped caring about YATS. A lot of pedal companies started being more open about their product as a result of FSB, so there are probably different reasons people get into the hobby: fewer people are getting in just to learn how to build a pedal they don't want to pay for, and more people doing it because it's a fun hobby. There's also less smugness that goes into the hobby. It's hard to be smug about knowing what's in the box when the company is already telling everyone. (FTR, I think this is a good thing.)
This might give the appearance that there's less excitement, or something. Overall I think the hobby is definitely more populous now than it was when I started. There are fewer build reports of late, but that might just be that the current crop of people here are less inclined to post. Meanwhile some of us either don't have the time or money to build right now, or don't have anything we really want to make. Until the last couple weeks I hadn't even stepped on a pedal in quite some time.
the stuff I build for myself ... you're lucky if you get any indication of what the knobs/switches do. not exactly a lot to look at externally. I guess you could marvel at the wiring that I keep short but not routed or that I'm that guy that still doesn't use 3PDT boards. I went all out the other day and bought lettering stickers from the scrapbook section of walmart so I could keep the knobs straight on my vertical layout fuzz factory ... fancy. that said, I enjoy seeing a cool etched enclosure, someone's tidy routed wiring, resistor/cap orientation OCD on full display, etc. I'll make more of an effort to put something on the build reports ... gives me a goal I guess.
As someone who is still really new to all of this I would say this DIY community is booming. Social media is littered with builders and players. I'm the only person I know who build though.
I got into the hobby for the reason that Midwayfair said, because I wanted to build pedals that I didn't want to pay for. Or in my personal case, that I just could never afford because I was unemployed at the time. It then got completely out of hand as I got a little more money thanks to a job and then I discovered places like Tayda and I was building 4 to 5 pedals a month. For a while I could justify it because while I had already plenty of pedals, this new build might kick an old build off my pedal board. Even if I already had a gazillion overdrives, distortions or fuzzes. And then I got an Axe-FX and I didn't really need a pedal board full of DIY pedals any more. Or a pedal board. Or an amp. And then you realize, why build any pedals any more? I still check Madbean and Tagboard regularly, as I like the community, I still see plenty of interesting designs coming out, I reckon without my Axe-FX I would have jumped on the FV-1 bandwagon with gusto. But I have an Axe-FX, it can do all those things. Why bother?
And now I switched to building guitars instead.
Another big thing is that digital is just so good now. I have a Kemper and it is really an unbelievable piece of gear. The Helix is an even more economical option and it is superb as well. If you can spend $1500 on a Helix and have everything you could ever want there is really no driving force to build. Shoot I probably have $1500 of pedal junk (at retail) in my basement right now.
Right now i build when I can because I enjoy it, but there's no urgency.
I can only speak for myself, but I lost interest in building more tube screamers, klones, muffs, fuzzes. The last few I built were based on CMOS logic inverters. I think we all got into this initially to build klones :)
My interests moved into maker/DIY stuff with microcontrollers and Pis, sensor networks with a smattering of machine learning. I'm a much better programmer than I am a musician so I tend to gravitate in that direction if I don't put my foot down.
I've slowed down my building, but that is largely because I only get payed during the school year. Its a frugal summer for me (especially with my power bill doubling in the summer months, hooray 115F outside temperatures).
That said, I've been trying to teach myself board layout and design to pass the time. So far I have learned I am not very good at it ;D
(and for some reason I keep trying to make SMD versions of things, why do I torture myself like this...)
Quote from: playpunk on June 21, 2018, 04:05:57 PM
Another big thing is that digital is just so good now. I have a Kemper and it is really an unbelievable piece of gear. The Helix is an even more economical option and it is superb as well. If you can spend $1500 on a Helix and have everything you could ever want there is really no driving force to build. Shoot I probably have $1500 of pedal junk (at retail) in my basement right now.
Right now i build when I can because I enjoy it, but there's no urgency.
Digital gets better and better, almost exponentially. The Helix is already lightyears ahead of the original Red Bean, and for the first time a serious competition to Fractal's Axe-FX II. And they have recently released the Axe-FX III, which has ungodly amounts of DSP, 4 times as much. No more running out of CPU errors. Analog meanwhile can only improve incrementally. Even if we exclude the clones of existing classic pedals, which is basically most analog pedals, there's only so much you can do with analog electronics. And it doesn't help that more and more analog through hole components are disappearing. Making it harder for self sourcing newbies to get into the hobby. Most people I know already find classic through hole electronic soldering daunting, I can imagine they would be scared shitless by the idea of SMD electronic soldering.
I would expect pedal building, tagboard layouts, and everything else to be slow in the world outside the US for about the next month.
I don't know the history of DIY PCB suppliers that well. But if you look through the archives at tagboardeffects from early to recent, it is amazing how the layout designers' skill and sophistication evolved in just a few years, to the point where they've done most of the circuits that are practical to put on a modest sized stripboard.
I suspect common through hole components will be available for a long time, but in a SMT and digital world, music DIY may move more into the realm of software / algorithms for pre-fabbed hardware that provides a development environment (like FV-1 or Axoloti). However, music and musicians have strong vintage/nostalgia/mojo sympathies that will keep analog alive. Not just guitarists - I mean, people play 400 year old violins.
Quote from: oip on June 20, 2018, 07:27:21 PM
compared to things like belton brick and PT2399.
Tell me about it. I have two ideas for a PT2399 circuit that, as far as I know, have never been done. I'll be posting schematics over the next couple months. Now, they may not be especially practical, but they've never been done. That's kinda where we're at. ;D
Quote from: reddesert on June 22, 2018, 06:38:03 PM
I don't know the history of DIY PCB suppliers that well. But if you look through the archives at tagboardeffects from early to recent, it is amazing how the layout designers' skill and sophistication evolved in just a few years, to the point where they've done most of the circuits that are practical to put on a modest sized stripboard.
+1 to this. It was impressive what that community managed to become in a very short period of time. And it's worth saying that this one isn't too shabby either.
There are more options now, and I think that's diffused the group a fair bit. When I started building it was basically tonepad and GGG. Now it's a neverending list of options, and almost all of them are good. Aion. PedalPCB. Etc.
Back in the day the community was concentrated in a handful of places, and that gave it more of a community feel. Now it's more spread out.
Also, to follow up on jkokura's post, the door really has opened to PCB design and manufacture, but for me at least, the spur wasn't the availability of videos or resources per se (although I sure appreciated your series!). It was more a matter of seeing other people in the group do it. That took the mystery away. It was a matter of thinking "Hey, if all of these other people are doing it, maybe it isn't as hard as I thought." That's what got me into learning how to use EAGLE and DIY boards. And with OSHpark, that is a major change from the way the community operated even just a few years ago. We used to be limited to what a few leaders built and put out there (and as Jon said, that was a boatload of YATS). But now with the rise of stripboard builds and PCB making, there are a lot more builders who doing their own thing. And I think that's probably healthy.
I enjoyed it myself when I could understand the circuit blocks and was bouncing around ideas for tweaks.
Part of the reason the Beatles broke up was so they could do what they wanted when they wanted. Without coordinating with three other people, and to leave behind Paul's insistence they work hard at Beatles music. Personal priorities change. I have 15 builds ready to box and I have no self momentum to get it done right now. I am doing a lot of work on my house and my father's house also. I work with children's charities, volunteer for Habitat for Humanity, mow my yard, coach baseball and basketball, blah, blah, blah. I am a single parent. I don't do many things for pleasure, and when I do find an hour of me time, I play music instead of solder, drill, or paint.
When I got into this @7-8 yrs ago,FSB was dynamic and a community, my son was little and had few external activities and I was able to do this often and heavy. Now I just come to the forum to see what my friends are doing.
I see two things:
- Brian's unbelievable kindness, openess and generosity in sharing his library paired with Jakob's tutorials (got me started)
- The analog 'boutique' builders have upped their game to beyond simple DIY limits. 5 years ago a DIY pedal had better guts and build quality than a JHS pedal. With the Bonsai and Muffaletta they did something that is basically a DIY killer. There's more examples.
I've been noticing a decline in forum activity on MBP for a while (I for one don't post that much anymore). But, I'm dedicated to keeping this place alive.
Quote from: Rockhorst on June 23, 2018, 01:16:10 AM
Muffaletta they did something that is basically a DIY killer.
I'm pretty sure you can DIY a Muffaletta because it's all based around a CMOS IC multi-switch thingie (50 cents and readily available). It's just a lot of work to trace it because of all the parts.
Most of the DIY killers are digital: Red Panda, Nuenaber, etc. But even digital is quickly becoming a DIY mainstay.
But the real DIY killer, most likely, is (as has been mentioned) the $25 Chinese knockoffs of boutique and classic pedals. Can't buy the parts that cheap, so it sort of takes away *some* of the incentive for *some* of the builders. For me it was never really about cost/money, but for some people it probably is/was.
true true
Quote from: Muadzin on June 22, 2018, 03:18:02 PM
Quote from: playpunk on June 21, 2018, 04:05:57 PM
Another big thing is that digital is just so good now. I have a Kemper and it is really an unbelievable piece of gear. The Helix is an even more economical option and it is superb as well. If you can spend $1500 on a Helix and have everything you could ever want there is really no driving force to build. Shoot I probably have $1500 of pedal junk (at retail) in my basement right now.
Right now i build when I can because I enjoy it, but there's no urgency.
Digital gets better and better, almost exponentially. The Helix is already lightyears ahead of the original Red Bean, and for the first time a serious competition to Fractal's Axe-FX II. And they have recently released the Axe-FX III, which has ungodly amounts of DSP, 4 times as much. No more running out of CPU errors. Analog meanwhile can only improve incrementally. Even if we exclude the clones of existing classic pedals, which is basically most analog pedals, there's only so much you can do with analog electronics. And it doesn't help that more and more analog through hole components are disappearing. Making it harder for self sourcing newbies to get into the hobby. Most people I know already find classic through hole electronic soldering daunting, I can imagine they would be scared shitless by the idea of SMD electronic soldering.
The digital rack gear like AxeFX and Kemper is getting very sophisticated and quite wonderful. To me, it represents the return of the rack gear that was so popular in the 80's and early 90's. It'll certainly have an effect on the pedal industry, but I do think those things tend to ebb and flow. I think the drive back towards pedals in the late 90's wasn't only because people didn't like the sound of digital rack gear (and it is much better now), but that many folks got tired of the complicated switching schemes involved in a rack setup and many preferred the simplicity of a handful of stomp boxes that they could dial in quickly without having to dig into sub-menus. I loved my rack gear, but I did spend hours setting up presets.
I've built all I want to for me and nobody is asking me to build guitar fx. Nothing new and interesting has really grabbed my interest that I've just had to build. So I've re-focused my need to tinker on old games consoles and computers. I've been restoring a load of those over the last year or so.
I did do some guitar electronics the other day in a couple of Cleggy's Felines. Lovely things.
Quote from: pickdropper on June 23, 2018, 08:51:07 AM
Quote from: Muadzin on June 22, 2018, 03:18:02 PM
Quote from: playpunk on June 21, 2018, 04:05:57 PM
Another big thing is that digital is just so good now. I have a Kemper and it is really an unbelievable piece of gear. The Helix is an even more economical option and it is superb as well. If you can spend $1500 on a Helix and have everything you could ever want there is really no driving force to build. Shoot I probably have $1500 of pedal junk (at retail) in my basement right now.
Right now i build when I can because I enjoy it, but there's no urgency.
Digital gets better and better, almost exponentially. The Helix is already lightyears ahead of the original Red Bean, and for the first time a serious competition to Fractal's Axe-FX II. And they have recently released the Axe-FX III, which has ungodly amounts of DSP, 4 times as much. No more running out of CPU errors. Analog meanwhile can only improve incrementally. Even if we exclude the clones of existing classic pedals, which is basically most analog pedals, there's only so much you can do with analog electronics. And it doesn't help that more and more analog through hole components are disappearing. Making it harder for self sourcing newbies to get into the hobby. Most people I know already find classic through hole electronic soldering daunting, I can imagine they would be scared shitless by the idea of SMD electronic soldering.
The digital rack gear like AxeFX and Kemper is getting very sophisticated and quite wonderful. To me, it represents the return of the rack gear that was so popular in the 80's and early 90's. It'll certainly have an effect on the pedal industry, but I do think those things tend to ebb and flow. I think the drive back towards pedals in the late 90's wasn't only because people didn't like the sound of digital rack gear (and it is much better now), but that many folks got tired of the complicated switching schemes involved in a rack setup and many preferred the simplicity of a handful of stomp boxes that they could dial in quickly without having to dig into sub-menus. I loved my rack gear, but I did spend hours setting up presets.
Maybe it's time for us to learn some Juce API, do Kickstarter for open source Kemper/Fractal with TigerShark DSP hardware and grow it
Quote from: pickdropper on June 23, 2018, 08:51:07 AM
The digital rack gear like AxeFX and Kemper is getting very sophisticated and quite wonderful. To me, it represents the return of the rack gear that was so popular in the 80's and early 90's. It'll certainly have an effect on the pedal industry, but I do think those things tend to ebb and flow. I think the drive back towards pedals in the late 90's wasn't only because people didn't like the sound of digital rack gear (and it is much better now), but that many folks got tired of the complicated switching schemes involved in a rack setup and many preferred the simplicity of a handful of stomp boxes that they could dial in quickly without having to dig into sub-menus. I loved my rack gear, but I did spend hours setting up presets.
Thing is though, space and time are curved and eventually the infinite comes around to its original position. If you are a guy who uses a couple of pedals into an amp then that setup is preferable to a classic 80's rack. But chances were those guys never had a rack to abandon in the first place. If you want more then just a boost, echo and some dirt, the pedal board will get bigger. In which case you need a good quality pedal board, reliable cabling, a good power supply. If you don't want to tap dance you need switchers, in which case you need more cabling, and some switchers come with presets controlling pedals like Strymon with MIDI. In which case you're basically back to that 80's rack, just in pedal board shape. ;D
Quote from: fair.child on June 23, 2018, 12:42:07 PM
Maybe it's time for us to learn some Juce API, do Kickstarter for open source Kemper/Fractal with TigerShark DSP hardware and grow it
Maybe I could. If only I could be arsed. Not meant as a snipe or insult, more of a sigh. I'm really too busy with way too many things.
Quote from: Muadzin on June 24, 2018, 01:25:40 PM
Quote from: pickdropper on June 23, 2018, 08:51:07 AM
The digital rack gear like AxeFX and Kemper is getting very sophisticated and quite wonderful. To me, it represents the return of the rack gear that was so popular in the 80's and early 90's. It'll certainly have an effect on the pedal industry, but I do think those things tend to ebb and flow. I think the drive back towards pedals in the late 90's wasn't only because people didn't like the sound of digital rack gear (and it is much better now), but that many folks got tired of the complicated switching schemes involved in a rack setup and many preferred the simplicity of a handful of stomp boxes that they could dial in quickly without having to dig into sub-menus. I loved my rack gear, but I did spend hours setting up presets.
Thing is though, space and time are curved and eventually the infinite comes around to its original position. If you are a guy who uses a couple of pedals into an amp then that setup is preferable to a classic 80's rack. But chances were those guys never had a rack to abandon in the first place. If you want more then just a boost, echo and some dirt, the pedal board will get bigger. In which case you need a good quality pedal board, reliable cabling, a good power supply. If you don't want to tap dance you need switchers, in which case you need more cabling, and some switchers come with presets controlling pedals like Strymon with MIDI. In which case you're basically back to that 80's rack, just in pedal board shape. ;D
Quote from: fair.child on June 23, 2018, 12:42:07 PM
Maybe it's time for us to learn some Juce API, do Kickstarter for open source Kemper/Fractal with TigerShark DSP hardware and grow it
Maybe I could. If only I could be arsed. Not meant as a snipe or insult, more of a sigh. I'm really too busy with way too many things.
I know quite a few people that went from rack gear back to the simplicity of pedals. I also know folks that went Fractal and went back to simple analog pedals and folks that went Fractal and still love it. It's difficult to argue that something like a Fractal rig can offer a vast array of options for gigging musicians in a smaller footprint. One guy in particular I know is in a cover band and likes it because he can get close enough to a lot of famous sounds directly into the board. He doesn't like it as much as the tube amps in his home studio, but he's sick of carrying a bigger rig around and it's a practical solution for him.
But yeah, if you have a Strymon rig with a ton of midi switching, the simplicity aspect isn't really there anymore.
Those that have climaxed and said that they've built all they need, are they willing to share their eagle files?
I shared some of my old projects on oshpark, and someone downloaded them, got a load fabbed cheap from China, and started selling them themselves, with NO WORD to me. (I found out through a forumite letting me know.)
I'm kinda soured on the idea.
Quote from: alanp on June 24, 2018, 06:46:09 PM
I shared some of my old projects on oshpark, and someone downloaded them, got a load fabbed cheap from China, and started selling them themselves, with NO WORD to me. (I found out through a forumite letting me know.)
I'm kinda soured on the idea.
Thats pretty rough Alan...How did they download the files from OSHpark though? I thought once you uploaded you couldnt download, even if you are the author of the files?
Quote from: chromesphere on June 24, 2018, 08:50:09 PM
Thats pretty rough Alan...How did they download the files from OSHpark though? I thought once you uploaded you couldnt download, even if you are the author of the files?
There is a "Download" button next to the board order button on OSHPark listings. You get the .brd file directly.
I've appreciated it as it has helped me learn some tricks about board design, but I have never used them to order anything.
Quote from: somnif on June 24, 2018, 08:57:59 PM
Quote from: chromesphere on June 24, 2018, 08:50:09 PM
Thats pretty rough Alan...How did they download the files from OSHpark though? I thought once you uploaded you couldnt download, even if you are the author of the files?
There is a "Download" button next to the board order button on OSHPark listings. You get the .brd file directly.
I've appreciated it as it has helped me learn some tricks about board design, but I have never used them to order anything.
What the hell, is that new? Ive never even noticed that before! Just reaffirms my stance on shared projects, dont share what you dont want exploited. Its a shame there are unscrupulous people out there abusing others generosity....
Quote from: drog_trog on June 24, 2018, 02:42:07 PM
Those that have climaxed and said that they've built all they need, are they willing to share their eagle files?
Ours are still with Rej for first refusal if Grind gets back off the ground. Otherwise ours will find another way to the DIYers that want to build them (probably me doing group buys).
Quote from: drog_trog on June 24, 2018, 02:42:07 PM
Those that have climaxed and said that they've built all they need, are they willing to share their eagle files?
As stated by others, they shouldn't. A good layout can take a few nights work for bigger circuits. The author deserves some credit for that.
That said, But this place has such awesome resources that you shouldn't have to.
First off, If you need a board just PM the person who has produced/sold the board in the past and they will probably help you out. Or put up a request, I've a heap of PCB designs that I've never officially released, but I could help you out with simple stuff.
If all else fails, Brian has most awesomely shared his entire library with the community. This is what got a lot of people started with Eagle in the first place. Add Jakob's (jkokura) youtube series on Eagle (the best tutorial for pedal purposes) and you are good to go and make your own!
From my perspective, being commercially involved in the DIY scene for over 5 years now, every year has been consistently better than the last. I half-quit my job last fall to focus on Aion and it has turned out to be a very good move.
As others have said, this topic has come up every year for the past few years. One characteristic I've noticed is that it always happens in the summer. The forums all have less discussion during the summer months. And my own sales will drop 10-30% as compared to September through May. It always picks back up.
But yes, there is also a bit of an effect where a lot of us "old timers" aren't really building for ourselves anymore so the hobby becomes more one of shooting the breeze and helping others be successful. That's the lifecycle of the hobby though. Tons of new builders all the time, but not many of them ever get beyond the intermediate level, because once you've built 10 pedals, you don't really need any new ones. So if you really are building them for the utility of it (e.g. having some cool pedals that you'll actually use) then you'll move on to something else before long. If you're building them for the fun of it, you might build several dozen, and will probably learn to design your own along the way, at which point you'll be less interested in new projects from others, but still very much actively involved in the community.
I build about a pedal a month and work on synth related projects too.
As my job has become huge in my life it's all pushed to the edges, and playing in bands takes away from DIY too. What I notice is it's not the DIY that's missing but the ability to spend "recreational" time on the internet conversing with people about it in communities like this, and like diystompboxes.com and electro-music.com
It's been amazing to play even a peripheral role in project development or testing and just brainstorming.
I just don't use the internet as much as I used to.
maybe in an "up" economy it's the same for others. I do solder, but after working 45-60 hours a week I can't even drum up the answer my own emails let alone jump on the forum.
it's sad and I miss the community interaction I was able to previously have.
Strategy
For me, my "decline" has been entirely due to the fact that my basement workshop is being renovated (been going on for several months now), and so I can't just pop down there for a quick build session. I have several projects I want to finish up and a few other to explore further with breadboarding. It's all on hiatus until after this summer's vacation, when I'll have some time to reorganize everything.
I have to admit, however, that after a while there's only so many tube screamers and fuzzes you can build for yourself before you get saturated. So the rate at which I work on PCB and vero projects will naturally slow down after a while unless I can give some pedals away ;).
One thing I've been doing for the past several years is to get broken pedals for cheap on eBay and Reverb and repair them (to perhaps sell later). My focus has been on older effects from the 70s, 80s, and 90s, and avoid anything digital. But I have successfully fixed several pedals and resold a few at a good price. Perhaps my best success was bringing an Ibanez RC99 chorus back to life after someone had used the wrong polarity power supply (yikes, what a mess the power protection diode was! :o ). I also have an old Vox Buckingham waiting for additional work... :)
Quote from: Frank_NH on June 27, 2018, 10:44:43 AM
One thing I've been doing for the past several years is to get broken pedals for cheap on eBay and Reverb and repair them (to perhaps sell later). My focus has been on older effects from the 70s, 80s, and 90s, and avoid anything digital. But I have successfully fixed several pedals and resold a few at a good price. Perhaps my best success was bringing an Ibanez RC99 chorus back to life after someone had used the wrong polarity power supply (yikes, what a mess the power protection diode was! :o ). I also have an old Vox Buckingham waiting for additional work... :)
So YOU'RE the one that keeps outbidding me :P
Quote from: Scruffie on June 27, 2018, 11:34:54 AM
Quote from: Frank_NH on June 27, 2018, 10:44:43 AM
One thing I've been doing for the past several years is to get broken pedals for cheap on eBay and Reverb and repair them (to perhaps sell later). My focus has been on older effects from the 70s, 80s, and 90s, and avoid anything digital. But I have successfully fixed several pedals and resold a few at a good price. Perhaps my best success was bringing an Ibanez RC99 chorus back to life after someone had used the wrong polarity power supply (yikes, what a mess the power protection diode was! :o ). I also have an old Vox Buckingham waiting for additional work... :)
So YOU'RE the one that keeps outbidding me :P
I think you're both out bidding me too! Haha! I actually have a few that I've been meaning to put on "the bay". I guess I'll message you two first.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Quote from: flanagan0718 on June 27, 2018, 04:56:01 PM
Quote from: Scruffie on June 27, 2018, 11:34:54 AM
Quote from: Frank_NH on June 27, 2018, 10:44:43 AM
One thing I've been doing for the past several years is to get broken pedals for cheap on eBay and Reverb and repair them (to perhaps sell later). My focus has been on older effects from the 70s, 80s, and 90s, and avoid anything digital. But I have successfully fixed several pedals and resold a few at a good price. Perhaps my best success was bringing an Ibanez RC99 chorus back to life after someone had used the wrong polarity power supply (yikes, what a mess the power protection diode was! :o ). I also have an old Vox Buckingham waiting for additional work... :)
So YOU'RE the one that keeps outbidding me :P
I think you're both out bidding me too! Haha! I actually have a few that I've been meaning to put on "the bay". I guess I'll message you two first.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Heh! No, I usually get my broken pedals on Reverb where you don't have to bid... :D
One pedal I got from eBay that turned into a keeper was an old Carvin TO-1 overdrive. I traced it and it turned out to be a part-for-part replication of the Boss SD-1. After fixing it (replacing pots and fixing the switching system), I found it to be a nice-sounding, slightly warmer tube screamer variant. The case is also the one of the most rugged steel enclosures I've ever run across!
One tip for Reverb - set up a Feed with the keywords pedal --> non-functioning. Then you'll see all the non-functioning (aka broken) pedals as soon as they are listed. Happy hunting!
Quote from: Frank_NH on June 28, 2018, 12:22:56 PM
One tip for Reverb - set up a Feed with the keywords pedal --> non-functioning. Then you'll see all the non-functioning (aka broken) pedals as soon as they are listed. Happy hunting!
I've tried this several times, and it always just says "Filter this search further to add it to your feed". Then again, no matter how many times I set it, Reverb refuses to believe I am not in France, so maybe the site just dislikes me....
Quote from: chromesphere on June 24, 2018, 09:02:01 PM
Quote from: somnif on June 24, 2018, 08:57:59 PM
Quote from: chromesphere on June 24, 2018, 08:50:09 PM
Thats pretty rough Alan...How did they download the files from OSHpark though? I thought once you uploaded you couldnt download, even if you are the author of the files?
There is a "Download" button next to the board order button on OSHPark listings. You get the .brd file directly.
I've appreciated it as it has helped me learn some tricks about board design, but I have never used them to order anything.
What the hell, is that new? Ive never even noticed that before! Just reaffirms my stance on shared projects, dont share what you dont want exploited. Its a shame there are unscrupulous people out there abusing others generosity....
This is completely not what I or anyone else intended with sharing their projects, and it's really worrying if it's true for everything.
I dont think anyone should be able to have access to anyone's board layouts, as someone pointed out, layouts can take a lot of time to get right but i would be up for sharing just the .sch file.
Quote from: midwayfair on June 28, 2018, 06:01:16 PM
This is completely not what I or anyone else intended with sharing their projects, and it's really worrying if it's true for everything.
I had no idea about this, either. But all my shared project have downloadable BRD files now. Even the ones I uploaded back in 2013.