First off, this is not about bragging because it frigging annoys me to no end (it's a bug, not a feature). My long term memory is kind of terrible. People tell me all the time about things I've said, or done, or events that I participated in and I honestly have no idea what they are talking about. It's like there's a blank space in my brain that I can't access no matter how hard I try. Sometimes it's rather embarrassing because it involves personal relationships and it is definitely not on purpose.
And yet, I can remember in detail a game level I played for like 20 minutes 10 years ago or the phone number for an old friend I haven't used in 20 years. Is this just normal aging? Surely everyone else has this problem, right? Maybe it's time for a DIY neurological scanner.
Same here. I can't remember what I had for breakfast but can recall that the pins on an rj45 jack are covered in 50 microns of gold.
Brian I can tell you are on good authority that you are unfortunately normal.
-Mike
Typo'd from my iphone
A video game you played for twenty minutes ten years ago is a very specific memory. Things like that are easier to remember than stuff that happens every day. Memories of people you see every day run together more, so specific things aren't as easy to remember unless its tied to something out of the ordinary.
There's probably games you played back then that you've completely forgotten about.
Quote from: madbean on November 09, 2018, 05:22:11 PM
Surely everyone else has this problem, right?
I can assure you that I have the exact same problem.
I've actually destroyed relationships due to this problem :o My theory has always been that I'm a reading/writing/doing sort of learner, not a hearing/social type, so unless I bring an almost academic focus to bear on what a person is saying to me, I'm just not equipped to easily retain it. (I'm bad with faces, too. It's a problem.)
Your story sounds far too familiar my friend. I've heard lots of stories, cool ones about myself that I wish I could remember cause it sounds like I had a good time.
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I was having this exactly conversation the other night. My friend forgot lyrics to basically all his songs all night. At the end, he was saying, "I do this literally every day and still forget words, but I can quote stats for a bunch of Warhammer stuff from 15-20 years ago."
I think this is how brains works. As you get older, the short term memory goes first as your brain cells start failing. Having the quite unpleasant experience of watching someone suffer from dementia first hand over a period of 6 years, you watch as recent stuff no longer sinks in at all, literally short term memory can go in a matter of minutes. But as it gets worse the more they forget, eventually regressing to a child like state, because those are the memories that are most real and are still hanging around.
My memory is fucked (I have no doubt it's hereditary). I'd be completely screwed without a calendar app that reminds me what I'm doing on a morning. Only this week, I'd forgotten that I'd arranged to be somewhere last night only 3 days earlier. Thankfully my friends know to remind me, and though it's a bit of a joke among them, they do know if they don't I'll forget. My memory for people/faces is even worse, but I'm really good a blagging when it comes to people running into me who I'm supposed to know.
It's also why when it comes to pedal building I have an extensive stash of knowledge and I note a lot of stuff on the website. Because not long after building something, I'll forget most things about it. People ask which trannies I used, and I always have to ask Cleggy, because I just don't know.
...and yet, lyrics to music I listened to as a child, all in there. The maze in Atari's Adventure... I picked up a 2600 last year, hadn't played adventure for probably 35 years, breezed through it. I have odd retention when it comes to some technical things, where I can remember the minutia of it. This is the bit I can't explain, because other things just vanish.
I was a AIX technical specialist when I resigned 6 or so years ago. People ask why I don't get back into it and honestly it's because I don't fucking remember about 90% of it. I've had dreams/nightmares about getting a job and just sitting there blank, because it's just not there anymore. Losing my memory scares the shit out of me.
Quote from: juansolo on November 10, 2018, 01:30:51 AM
The maze in Atari's Adventure... I picked up a 2600 last year, hadn't played adventure for probably 35 years, breezed through it.
https://youtu.be/rNK44eqvP38
(Not sure why I can't embed this vid.)
After about 24 years, I can still tell you exactly where the secret passages and goodies are hidden in the first few levels of Donkey Kong Country on SNES. No idea, but I have a certain part of my brain reserved for useless memory. I really tend to remember really weird stuff.
I still remember all the Doom cheat codes and, of course, the Contra cheat code.
Can't remember what I ate for breakfast yesterday.
QuoteFirst off, this is not about bragging because it frigging annoys me to no end (it's a bug, not a feature). My long term memory is kind of terrible. People tell me all the time about things I've said, or done, or events that I participated in and I honestly have no idea what they are talking about. It's like there's a blank space in my brain that I can't access no matter how hard I try. Sometimes it's rather embarrassing because it involves personal relationships and it is definitely not on purpose.
And yet, I can remember in detail a game level I played for like 20 minutes 10 years ago or the phone number for an old friend I haven't used in 20 years. Is this just normal aging? Surely everyone else has this problem, right? Maybe it's time for a DIY neurological scanner.
@madbean I am a neuroscientist who studies human memory...that's my day job anyway ;) What you're talking about sounds pretty normal. People generally forget most stuff that happened a long time ago, but you're much more aware of all the stuff you forgot from the last week because people remind you of it. In fact people forget most of the details of stuff that happens in a day. I am absolutely terrible at remembering faces, names, and most anything that involves people, but I am much better with things that involve bands, guitars, or other random stuff. Some of that probably boils down to dopamine, but that's a deep rabbit hole.
Anyway, if you are forgetting that you had a conversation a few hours ago--not just what was said, but the fact that you had a conversation--then I'd be concerned. Or if you find yourself getting lost very easily. Or if your close friends and family are concerned. Or finally, if you are having other problems like headaches, sleep apnea or insomnia, depression, etc.
Otherwise, I'd be more inclined to file that in the "getting old sucks" bin, which I am all too familiar with!
In case you are interested, here is a recent interview I did on why we forget names: http://time.com/5348486/why-do-you-forget-names/ (http://time.com/5348486/why-do-you-forget-names/)
At work, we have a revolving door for new people, pretty much. I don't bother remembering names until they've stuck around for six months or so. (Our department has a core of people who have been there for years, and a constant flux of newbies to make up numbers. Occasionally, a newbie graduates to staying in the department.)
Sometimes with these things it's not necessarily memory at all. I thought my memory for people's faces was terrible, but it turned out that I very likely have prosopagnosia or "face blindness"--the inability to recognize faces. I got to take the test for it at my university and failed it. Epically. I was crusing through the questions completely sure that I was answering everything correctly, but in the end I scored...zero. Even blind guessing should have gotten me 1 or 2.
It actually made me feel better about not being able to remember names. Because it's likely not the name I'm forgetting--since I can't recognize the person's face to begin with, there's no starting point for my memory to begin with.
I am proud to say that I am the Cliff Clavin of my family ;)
Quote from: ChRa on November 10, 2018, 09:13:13 AM
Otherwise, I'd be more inclined to file that in the "getting old sucks" bin, which I am all too familiar with!
In case you are interested, here is a recent interview I did on why we forget names: http://time.com/5348486/why-do-you-forget-names/ (http://time.com/5348486/why-do-you-forget-names/)
That and your line of work are very cool.
I feel that there are certain areas where I have very vivid memories, and often, I think, these were formed during a heightened state of attention. For me a lot of the time that has to do with outdoor activity (cycling, hiking, climbing type of things). Because I like what I'm doing, but also, I think, because it requires a lot of attention at the moment the memory is being formed. Like everyone, I also sometimes forget people's names immediately after introduction, or which of my friends told me a story or which I told a story to, and I think that's related to distractions and not paying as much attention in the moment.
Interesting. I'm awful with names and faces myself. Seems like a trend here. However I'm also awful when it comes to long term personal event memory. I retain a lot of information related to engineering (I'm an engineer) and other technical things. However, I live in what I refer to as a short term window. Basically I can recall events of the past year or two but before that it's very sparse or non-existent. My memory pre-high school is basically zero. High school, almost nothing. College, very little. First 10 years of work just a bit more than college. It's odd. And the window moves with time. I'm two to four years I'm unlikely to be able to recall any real memories of my life today. For example, I hardly remember the early parts of my relationship with my now fiancée and we started dating less than 5 years ago. It kind of sucks, honestly.
Oh and for reference I'm only 33. So I don't think it's age related, especially as it's been ongoing for as long as I can remember... which of course isn't that long. :)
I went to a very small high school, 38 kids in my graduating class. I literally got on a plane the night of graduation and never went back. Fast forward 15 years later I met up with a couple classmates I was close friends with and they started dropping names while telling stories. I'm just sitting there looking blank-faced over my beer with no idea who they were talking about. It was mostly about kids in my age range, I'd forgotten most of them.
Quote from: ChRa on November 10, 2018, 09:13:13 AM
@madbean I am a neuroscientist who studies human memory...that's my day job anyway ;) What you're talking about sounds pretty normal. People generally forget most stuff that happened a long time ago, but you're much more aware of all the stuff you forgot from the last week because people remind you of it. In fact people forget most of the details of stuff that happens in a day. I am absolutely terrible at remembering faces, names, and most anything that involves people, but I am much better with things that involve bands, guitars, or other random stuff. Some of that probably boils down to dopamine, but that's a deep rabbit hole.
Anyway, if you are forgetting that you had a conversation a few hours ago--not just what was said, but the fact that you had a conversation--then I'd be concerned. Or if you find yourself getting lost very easily. Or if your close friends and family are concerned. Or finally, if you are having other problems like headaches, sleep apnea or insomnia, depression, etc.
Otherwise, I'd be more inclined to file that in the "getting old sucks" bin, which I am all too familiar with!
In case you are interested, here is a recent interview I did on why we forget names: http://time.com/5348486/why-do-you-forget-names/ (http://time.com/5348486/why-do-you-forget-names/)
Well dang...we have a fancy pants here! (Actually, that's great!) Yeah, it's good to know that this is all pretty normal stuff. Nothing about my memory concerns or alarms me other than it can be frustrating. It's also getting a bit harder to remember things I've learned on purpose. I know that happens to everyone, though.
The mnemonic thing from the article is bang on. I used to do that a lot. For example, when I first started in electronics I could never remember the cathode and anode on diodes. Then I made a small mnemonic for it "The cathode is flat". Once I connected it to a visual representation (the schematic symbol) it just "imprinted". After a while I didn't need the mnemonic part anymore.
While we are on the subject, maybe someone can explain to me why we perceive our consciousness right behind (or just above) our eyes. I mean, I know that's where the think-jelly is but why should all my conscious thoughts be located seemingly in one physical spot? I want to think in my stomach at some point (but not with it).
Hi,
Don't mind me, just lurking around the place...
What were we talking about?
and...
Who are you?
Seriously, never could remember people's names, sometimes not even people I've known for a long time, but if I have a break from seeing them... poof, it's gone.
Wouldn't be too bad of a problem if I could remember faces...
I, too, remember small insignificant moments in my life — truly insignificant — in great detail with crisp clarity. No idea why such an inconsequential moment like "this" or "that" would lodge itself in my shambles of a mind palace ... but, can I remember to do my taxes on time?
Back to my corner, ever lurking...
FF
Quote from: madbean on November 10, 2018, 05:21:12 PM
While we are on the subject, maybe someone can explain to me why we perceive our consciousness right behind (or just above) our eyes. I mean, I know that's where the think-jelly is but why should all my conscious thoughts be located seemingly in one physical spot? I want to think in my stomach at some point (but not with it).
Possibly because vision is so incredibly important to most humans?
My mental association for anode/cathode on diodes probably clicked when I realised that cathode is also sometimes spelt kathode, and the K looks like the stripe end of the diode symbol :)
this thread is strangely reassuring - i've got a decent memory but it's gotten very noticeably worse (to me anyway) in the last 10 years and i've put it down to getting older. i'm sure electronic overstimulation and everyone's attention span being whittled down to zero doesn't help either.
'LED polarity' is one of my more heavily googled phrases, right along with 'capacitor uF conversion chart' and 'TL072 pinout'. maybe it'll sink in one day..
@cajone5: Hate to say it, but age-related memory decline starts at 30 (some would say earlier). Getting old sucks!
@madbean: Sorry didn't mean to be braggy--just thought I'd reassure you that you're not alone! And despite the fact that we do a lot of electroencephalography, I know almost nothing about proper electronics. DIYSB and this forum has been helpful, though.
One of the things that there's really no good research on: Do different people really learn in different ways? Some people say they are visual learners, others say they can't visualize at all. We don't really even know if, after controlling for IQ, there are really important differences between people in the ability to memorize things.
Quote from: ChRa on November 11, 2018, 09:27:48 AM
One of the things that there's really no good research on: Do different people really learn in different ways? Some people say they are visual learners, others say they can't visualize at all. We don't really even know if, after controlling for IQ, there are really important differences between people in the ability to memorize things.
I know I do. I can focus on being talked at for much more than 30 mins, beyond that I zone out. Always have since I was a kid. I used to get all sorts of shit for that to the point that at primary school (UK thing, from 8-11ish IIRC), from labeling me a daydreamer and a bit thick. They made me re-sit an exam on my own with a teacher stood over me because they were convinced I had cheated (it was obviously a subject I had some interest in...). When I nailed it a 2nd time they were genuinely dumbfounded.
That lack of attention continues to this day. Technical courses for my job, again I struggle to maintain concentration on the subject. But sit me in front of a computer and let me actually do it, and I'm there for hours until I fully have my head around something. I've always been better learning by doing, ever since I was a kid with Meccano and Lego.
Whoa!! MAJOR flashback. I'd totally forgotten about Meccano. I'm not sure but think it was more of a UK/CDN thing.
The only part about this memory thing that really bothers me is that over the years my wife has become convinced that I'm a complete idiot. There are days I'd be hard pressed to prove her wrong.
Quote from: gordo on November 12, 2018, 06:18:15 AM
Whoa!! MAJOR flashback. I'd totally forgotten about Meccano. I'm not sure but think it was more of a UK/CDN thing.
In the US, we had (have?) Erector instead of Meccano. Now, Meccano owns the Erector brand.
Anyone here see the TV program where James May crossed a Meccano bridge in Liverpool?
https://youtu.be/Ha37BzRvJAA
I would comment but since I'm at the end of this thread I can't remember what it is you said.
My wife often reminds me how bad my memory is. I think, perhaps, shes just making things up to pin blame on me. But im not sure because I think I have a bad memory.
Quote from: madbean on November 10, 2018, 05:21:12 PMWhile we are on the subject, maybe someone can explain to me why we perceive our consciousness right behind (or just above) our eyes. I mean, I know that's where the think-jelly is but why should all my conscious thoughts be located seemingly in one physical spot? I want to think in my stomach at some point (but not with it).
I think that's most cultural. The ancient Egyptians thought the heart was the seat of reason, not the seat of emotion. The ancient Romans thought the seat of emotion was the bowels.
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The major reason I never progressed in this hobby was my memory. By progression I mean once I got the easy basics down I quickly realized that I can't seem to recall the more difficult (to me) stuff. Shit simply doesn't stick with me unless I'm going over and over it for months/years on end.
I'll guess I'll probably remain a real good follower of directions and a real good implementer of others ideas and can build them but that is probably as far as I'll be able to go in understanding this electronics hobby.
Knowing my memory has never been good, this goes back to being my 20's, I'm in my mid 50's now, I realize that is just my DNA I guess. While I did get an MBA you would not believe the amount of studying I had to do to accomplish this. I never skipped class, listened and took notes both undergrad and MBA and I'm here to tell you I then had to hit the books and hard. I'm guessing I'm no genius ;D
But, this makes me want to ask: To what extent do you believe that memory is tied to IQ?
Quote from: TNblueshawk on November 15, 2018, 12:01:28 PM
The major reason I never progressed in this hobby was my memory. By progression I mean once I got the easy basics down I quickly realized that I can't seem to recall the more difficult (to me) stuff. Shit simply doesn't stick with me unless I'm going over and over it for months/years on end.
I'll guess I'll probably remain a real good follower of directions and a real good implementer of others ideas and can build them but that is probably as far as I'll be able to go in understanding this electronics hobby.
Knowing my memory has never been good, this goes back to being my 20's, I'm in my mid 50's now, I realize that is just my DNA I guess. While I did get an MBA you would not believe the amount of studying I had to do to accomplish this. I never skipped class, listened and took notes both undergrad and MBA and I'm here to tell you I then had to hit the books and hard. I'm guessing I'm no genius ;D
But, this makes me want to ask: To what extent do you believe that memory is tied to IQ?
My education is in law, so take that as a disclaimer. I know a lot of IQ tests are designed to avoid specific factual knowledge, but in practice it matters, and it especially matters for the kind of quasi-IQ tests you need to take to enter the professions or to get ear-marked as management material in the corporate world. The Wonderlic test is an example. Memory is a huge factor on that test. And the reading section of the LSAT and the verbal section of the GRE have major memory test components. In the reading section you read something at breakneck speed and then rush through questions that mostly based on what you remember from the assigned passage. You don't have time to re-read. Can't remember whether the second paragraph emphasized time constraints or sampling errors? Too bad, no law school for you. Can you remember the definition of pusillanimous? No? So much for grad school.
Are results on the tests strongly corrolated with success in school or in your later work? Not really! But hey, we've got to trim the herd in some way, so I guess this is as good as any (that's pretty much word for word for how the dean of admissions at my school justified the system when questioned). But it's pretty sobering that so much of the gatekeeping in our societies are based to heavily on something like this, particularly in an age when technology is rendering a lot of the emphasize on memory obsolete.
By chance (and in all likelihood because our new tech overlords' survillence of my life and interests), this popped up for me this morning. So there are people like me who are face blind, but there are also people who are facial recognition superstars and apparently never forget a face. Reminded me of an episode of 60 Minutes I saw years ago about people who can remember every minute of their lives with full recall. For those who might want to take a "glass half full" view of the subject of memory:
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/nov/11/super-recognisers-police-the-people-who-never-forget-a-face (https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/nov/11/super-recognisers-police-the-people-who-never-forget-a-face)
I feel that my memory seems fairly intact. I have much strengths and weaknesses, of course. I'm great with putting a face with a place or event, horrible with names (I don't remember some people of the church Ive attended for ten years with a congregation size of 40-50), and even worse with song lyrics. Whatever deficits I have in memory aren't discoverable by my wife because she currently suffers from "3-kid mom-brain."
The real annoying part of memory is wondering why my brain wants to hold on to where I was at the 53rd time I heard Timberlake's "Sexy Back." Every time I pass that intersection, that diddy gets triggered.